The Rohrbaugh Forum
Rohrbaugh Products and Accessories => Rohrbaugh Range Reports => Topic started by: RBorgers on September 18, 2011, 07:19:12 PM
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Picked up a new R9 last week and made it to the range today. Good news fired 8 rounds without a problem and was very accurate. The bad news the slide locked back about a half inch and would not close all the way. After inspecting the gun I found the firing pin retainer had rotated and was catching on the frame, it was all the way in with the firing pin protruding through it. I rotated back into the correct position and the slide would close. Has any one else experienced this problem?
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I seem to recall a past post with a similar problem but the cause was not identified as clearly as you described. I would call the factory tomorrow.
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If that retainer could just be "rotated" and not pulled out and slid back in; then it is totally out of spec, i.e., too small. You need a new/larger retainer.
Or maybe it was installed backwards ?
The rounded side goes to the outside and the flat flush against the slide.
Just some info to have before calling the factory.
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Picked up a new R9 last week and made it to the range today. Good news fired 8 rounds without a problem and was very accurate. The bad news the slide locked back about a half inch and would not close all the way. After inspecting the gun I found the firing pin retainer had rotated and was catching on the frame, it was all the way in with the firing pin protruding through it. I rotated back into the correct position and the slide would close. Has any one else experienced this problem?
RBorgers. Very good information above on what to do. Congrats on the new R9.
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Well I have called several times and left voice mail as well as filling out a web form and no return call yet.
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Maria will return your call.
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Well spoke with Maria and she was very helpful, but I have to pay for shipping. She said they would evaluate the problem at which time they could reimburse me for the shipping???
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Does any body have the address to ship a firearm back to Rohrbaugh. I got a email with instructions on how to ship a firearm back. There is an address on the bottom of the email and I want to verify it is correct before I ship it back. I have tried to call with no luck. The address I have is RFC, 73 E. Jefryn Blvd, Deer Park, Ny 11729.
Thanks
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Got it back today and went straight to the range where I shot 75 rounds without any problems. This really is a good shooting little gun.
Thanks Rohrbaugh!
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Got it back today and went straight to the range where I shot 75 rounds without any problems. This really is a good shooting little gun.
Thanks Rohrbaugh!
RBorgers. Everything does work out! Glad the Rohrbaugh is fine. Excellent shooting! Continue the enjoyment! :D
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Got it back today and went straight to the range where I shot 75 rounds without any problems. This really is a good shooting little gun.
Thanks Rohrbaugh!
I'm curious. Did Rohrbaugh reimburse your shipping expense for your pistols return to their factory?
I'm glad that your Pup is now healthy and that you're happy. :)
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My guess is they do not cover the shipping.
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My guess is they do not cover the shipping.
I'm thinking they might; since they said they would evaluate the problem. :) Hey! That's just a guess, too! :D
Well spoke with Maria and she was very helpful, but I have to pay for shipping. She said they would evaluate the problem at which time they could reimburse me for the shipping???
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When I had to send a S&W back for repairs and my LCP for the recall work they sent a box with a prepaid label, stick the gun in the box and call UPS for a pickup. :D
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When I had to send a S&W back for repairs and my LCP for the recall work they sent a box with a prepaid label, stick the gun in the box and call UPS for a pickup. :D
Excellent! ;)
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When I had to send a S&W back for repairs and my LCP for the recall work they sent a box with a prepaid label, stick the gun in the box and call UPS for a pickup. :D
I had the same experience with Ruger. Before I even hung up the phone, while speaking to their CSR, I had a UPS 2nd day air label e-mailed to me. I printed it out, boxed up the pistol and off it went.
Also, had the exact same experience with Springfield Arms. They are famous for outstanding customer service. If there is even the slightest concern from a customer, on any of their products, no matter how trivial, they send a pre-paid Overnight Air FedEx label.
That's why I was curious if Rohrbaugh reimbursed the OP since he commented that he had to return the pistol at his expense and it turned out that there had clearly been a problem with the pistol out of the box.
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And my experience with Kahr is that they sent me a prepaid shipping label. FedEx Overnight, and it cost me nothing. That seems pretty standard among the gun manufacturers.
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Picked up a new R9 last week and made it to the range today. Good news fired 8 rounds without a problem and was very accurate. The bad news the slide locked back about a half inch and would not close all the way. After inspecting the gun I found the firing pin retainer had rotated and was catching on the frame, it was all the way in with the firing pin protruding through it. I rotated back into the correct position and the slide would close. Has any one else experienced this problem?
Just got back from the range with my R9 Covert...had about 200 rounds through it since purchase without issue. New spring, grip screws tight, clean. On 2nd mag, had a failure to feed..had to pry the cartridge up with a small screwdriver and it went into battery...was shooting one handed and figured a limp wrist issue. Next mag, same thing but was holding tight one handed. Cleared that, fired another mag and on the last round, the slide locked back far enough that it was past the takedown pin. Couldn't budge it...got home and couldn't find a problem visually, but decided to cycle it briskly as if feeding a first round from a new mag and it went into battery. Now seems to function OK, but am not certain I want to fire it. Don't have time to take it down right now, but that is the next step. Suggestions otherwise?
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backup. What ammo were you shooting? Sounds like a metal partical (shaving) of some sort got lodged in the slide.
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Shooting Gold Dot 147. Just took it apart....no shavings seen. Pictures below were done before I cleaned it. The firing pin retainer was to my left looking at the slide from behind with slide turned up (see pics) but could be easily rotated with the tip of a knife, or moved to the right (see other pics). Seems to function OK with snap caps now, but.....?(http://i778.photobucket.com/albums/yy62/Adamsavage/R9%20firing%20pin%20retainer/R9firingpinretainerissue010.jpg)
(http://i778.photobucket.com/albums/yy62/Adamsavage/R9%20firing%20pin%20retainer/R9firingpinretainerissue002.jpg)(http://i778.photobucket.com/albums/yy62/Adamsavage/R9%20firing%20pin%20retainer/R9firingpinretainerissue006.jpg)(http://i778.photobucket.com/albums/yy62/Adamsavage/R9%20firing%20pin%20retainer/R9firingpinretainerissue011.jpg)
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Sorry about the orientation of the pictures in the previous post. Viewing the slide with it's open side up from behind, the "normal" position of the retainer appears to be on the left of the viewer. It could be easily moved to the right with the tip of a knife, or rotated slightly. I guess this is the same thing that the originator of this thread experienced...so, back to the factory?
:-\
John
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I see some debris, and you did say this was before cleaning; for me I would go down to at least 124 grain Gold Dots and try those after cleaning; I would definitely do that before sending it back; just my thoughts.
Others have used 147 grain without any problems, but I would have to at least try the 124 grain.
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I'll give it a try with 124's. Anybody know if their firing pin retainer moves the way this one does when manipulated? It was easily moved/rotated with the tip of a small screwdriver, but was not so loose that it flopped around.
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I had the same problem. I recently purchase a new R9 and took it to the range and after 30 rounds the slide got stuck. I could not tell what was preventing the slide from going forward but tried very hard in cycling the slide to get it to close but to no avail. I had to send it back to the factory and it was return with no explanation. I took it to the range and no issues since.
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Backup
The firing pin retainer should be able to slide up and down without much resistance with a small screwdriver. It should not be able to rotate.
If you insert a small screwdriver and press inward on the firing pin, you should be able to slide the firing pin retainer up. I have removed the retainer and firing pin on several on the Pups I have owned.
Let me know if you have any questions about this.
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l-elieze, I remember that post and follow-up and was looking for it when I found this one that started with the same problem. I've fired 147gr Gold Dots out of this pistol before with no issue, so this is definitely something new. If you look at the first post on this thread by RBorgers, he had the same problem and identified the loose firing pin retainer as the problem....sent it back to R and it came back working fine. I'll try firing it again tomorrow. I've been using Ed Brown lubricant on the rails although not heavily...may be cutting too much friction out of the equation, esp. w/147's? Anyway, we'll see. I give follow-up on this one.
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Backup
The firing pin retainer should be able to slide up and down without much resistance with a small screwdriver. It should not be able to rotate.
If you insert a small screwdriver and press inward on the firing pin, you should be able to slide the firing pin retainer up. I have removed the retainer and firing pin on several on the Pups I have owned.
Let me know if you have any questions about this.
Thanks Z, mine does move side to side/rotate when pushed, albeit gently, with a small screwdriver or probe. By moving the retainer "up" when the firing pin is pushed inward, I assume you mean while removing the retainer and pin, but not in anyway to readjust the position as a remedy to my problem?
Another question: when I push in on the firing pin from behind with a small punch, the punch actually disappears into the retainer about 1/8' before the firing pin protrudes out the front; I assumed that the pin, when struck by the hammer, moved forward with enough force to fire the primer and retract on the spring back into the bolt....is this correct, or do I have a broken firing pin? (I guess I will be able to tell when I test it tomorrow!).
Thanks for the help guys....frustrating not to be able to trust my carry piece. Now have to go back to the 642, the Kimber CDP or the new LWS .32 none of which I enjoy carrying as much as the R9.
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Back to the range today with the Covert R9. Fired Lawman 115, Spear Gold Dot 124 and one mag of Spear Gold Dot 147. Absolutely no problems until the last 2 6 shot mags when the trigger wouldn't predictably reset after the shot...grips were loose (tightened yesterday after shooting, loosened up after no more than 40 rounds fired!). I had Loctite blue on them a month ago, but apparently not enough. Going to get some of John's grip screws for sure!
Still a little worried about the movement of the firing pin retainer locking back the slide...would suggest anyone with that problem in the future do the following:
1. Let the pistol cool off
2. Pull the slide back as far as possible and let it go as if loading a first round...this may or may not work...
3. If not, slap the right side of the slide just above the grip sharply several times (preferable with the slide held as far back as possible which may require another set of hands to help) and retry #2...
4. If that doesn't work, pad the right side of the slide and tap sharply with a rubber mallet and repeat #2.
From the pictures I posted, it would appear that the retainer slips or rotates to the left (non-ejection) side of the pistol, and getting it to go back to the right will allow the slide to release. The question now is why does the retainer move, and should the pistol go back to the factory before being a CCW.
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Just spoke to Maria....discussed the 3 episodes in this thread and my pictures as posted. She will have a technician call me today or tomorrow to discuss the issue, but feels the pistol will need to come back to them. According to her the back of the handbook discusses warranty matters and how to return the weapon to them via USPO (Sounds like they send a letter to clear the shipment, but I have to get the book and read the section if I sent it back. Will await the tech's call. I'll keep everyone posted. John
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You defiantly need to have trust in your carry weapon. Sound like it need to go back to the factory to get serviced. Let know how you make out!
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Maria called back...Karl traveling but said to send it. She emails a letter explaining how to ship (you should read the warranty page of the handbook first..should replace special grips with original; etc. They get so many sent back that "have no problem they can find" that they don't pay for shipping to them. Recommends taking it apart and shipping as "machine parts" via USPO, UPS, Fedex as you wish. USPO doesn't ship guns, but this is done all the time. UPS will usually ship, but only from a central office. Don't know about FedEx. USPO much less expensive. Alternatively, can ship from your FFL, but it will come back to that FFL and you'll pay!
After cleaning it today, I found the firing pin retainer was in proper position and was harder to move to the wrong side, but still would be reasonably easily moved. Now carrying the Seecamp .32 primary or secondary to the Kimber CDP. I love the R9, but am becoming worried about the number of issues related on this forum by the relatively small number of owners. :-\
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I am sure Rohrbaugh will get it tuned up and ready to roar for you.
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Maria called back...Karl traveling but said to send it. She emails a letter explaining how to ship (you should read the warranty page of the handbook first..should replace special grips with original; etc. They get so many sent back that "have no problem they can find" that they don't pay for shipping to them. Recommends taking it apart and shipping as "machine parts" via USPO, UPS, Fedex as you wish. USPO doesn't ship guns, but this is done all the time. UPS will usually ship, but only from a central office. Don't know about FedEx. USPO much less expensive. Alternatively, can ship from your FFL, but it will come back to that FFL and you'll pay!
After cleaning it today, I found the firing pin retainer was in proper position and was harder to move to the wrong side, but still would be reasonably easily moved. Now carrying the Seecamp .32 primary or secondary to the Kimber CDP. I love the R9, but am becoming worried about the number of issues related on this forum by the relatively small number of owners. :-\
I have carried one of my R9s almost eight years with no problems.......now I'm starting to worry...have I just been lucky? :-\
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I don't think so, Jack. The successes outnumber the failures here and in those cases which are sometimes quite vocal, Rohrbaugh steps up to the plate and responds in a very positive fashion. There are a lot of long term happy campers on this forum and beyond.
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Well said tracker.
I completely agree! :)
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I have carried one of my R9s almost eight years with no problems.......now I'm starting to worry...have I just been lucky? :-\
No need to worry; you're fine! :)
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You just need to keep up on the maintenance Jack.
Be good to it and it will be good to you!
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You just need to keep up on the maintenance Jack.
Be good to it and it will be good to you!
Words to live by, when having guns! :)
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You just need to keep up on the maintenance Jack.
Be good to it and it will be good to you!
Maintenance may not be enough...Mine has always been thoroughly cleaned and lubed within hours of going to the range. Never dropped or abused. Practically new (and a Covert at that), and I had put at least 200 rounds through it with NO problems when it suddenly quit on me during a routine range trip. Certainly a cause for worry!
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Very true Backup. I do agree. There is always a chance for failure. I am sure Rohrbaugh will get it running right for you!
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Thanks Z. I sent it back today....was afraid to try sending even a disassembled weapon through the USPO (since it is technically illegal). Boxed it as required in Maria's email, shipped UPS. She said ship overnight, but with insurance that would have cost me about $125 (!) so I shipped it routine ground for about $36 insured (for $1800 as a Covert). I did include a letter as requested detailing the problem, but took the liberty of adding some suggestions re: customer service, shipping, etc. I do think with the small 9's from Kimber, Sig, Boberg and others Karl is going to run into a lot of competition that he has never had before. Some follow up as to what was done to repair the pistol and some help with shipping would be appreciated by the apparently many new/old owners who seem to be having problems, some of whom have now left us (or are in process of doing so). Heck, I even had a cheap little Keltec PF9 that wouldn't feed. Keltec sent me a shipping label and returned the pistol with an explanation. I sold it anyway due to the trigger pull, but it worked fine when returned. The R9 is the most comfortable carry of all of my handguns, so I do hope when it comes back it can be rehabilitated...the point I made in my letter was simply that without an explanation of what was wrong and why it won't happen again, I won't be able to trust it for carry. Since it is not a plinking pistol and since I don't keep safe queens, I would have to sell it and move on. Makes me sad 'cause I have been a true fan and an advocate to others.
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Please correct me if I am mistaken but I am under the impression that if an owner ships a handgun to the factory or a repair facility it must be shipped next day air by UPS or FEDEX, for example. There are ways to skirt around this through the USPS but not all legal unless shipped FFL to FFL. Have the rules changed?
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Please correct me if I am mistaken but I am under the impression that if an owner ships a handgun to the factory or a repair facility it must be shipped next day air by UPS or FEDEX, for example. There are ways to skirt around this through the USPS but not all legal unless shipped FFL to FFL. Have the rules changed?
see following link http://www.gunbroker.com/Support/SupportFAQView.aspx?faqid=1118
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Am I correct?
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Thanks Z. I sent it back today....was afraid to try sending even a disassembled weapon through the USPO (since it is technically illegal). Boxed it as required in Maria's email, shipped UPS. She said ship overnight, but with insurance that would have cost me about $125 (!) so I shipped it routine ground for about $36 insured (for $1800 as a Covert). I did include a letter as requested detailing the problem, but took the liberty of adding some suggestions re: customer service, shipping, etc. I do think with the small 9's from Kimber, Sig, Boberg and others Karl is going to run into a lot of competition that he has never had before. Some follow up as to what was done to repair the pistol and some help with shipping would be appreciated by the apparently many new/old owners who seem to be having problems, some of whom have now left us (or are in process of doing so). Heck, I even had a cheap little Keltec PF9 that wouldn't feed. Keltec sent me a shipping label and returned the pistol with an explanation. I sold it anyway due to the trigger pull, but it worked fine when returned. The R9 is the most comfortable carry of all of my handguns, so I do hope when it comes back it can be rehabilitated...the point I made in my letter was simply that without an explanation of what was wrong and why it won't happen again, I won't be able to trust it for carry. Since it is not a plinking pistol and since I don't keep safe queens, I would have to sell it and move on. Makes me sad 'cause I have been a true fan and an advocate to others.
backup. I'm sure, too, that Rohrbaugh will have your Covert back shooting as it should.
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Am I correct?
Did you read the gunbroker link? If you did you know as much as I do............If you ship the wrong way it could be a felony... :'(.....and you would lose your carry permit in our state(Ohio)
The most important thing to know is that you must only ship guns to a licensed dealer. If the buyer is not a licensed dealer, he will have to make arrangements to ship the item to a dealer in his state.
Before you ship a gun, the buyer must fax or mail you a copy of the dealer's signed FFL license. You can only ship the gun to the address on the license. You must inform the carrier that the package contains a firearm. Of course, the firearm cannot be shipped loaded; ammunition may not be shipped in the same box. You should take the copy of the signed FFL with you when you take the item to be shipped in case the shipper wishes to see it.
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Thanks Z. I sent it back today....was afraid to try sending even a disassembled weapon through the USPO (since it is technically illegal). Boxed it as required in Maria's email, shipped UPS. She said ship overnight, but with insurance that would have cost me about $125 (!) so I shipped it routine ground for about $36 insured (for $1800 as a Covert). I did include a letter as requested detailing the problem, but took the liberty of adding some suggestions re: customer service, shipping, etc. I do think with the small 9's from Kimber, Sig, Boberg and others Karl is going to run into a lot of competition that he has never had before. Some follow up as to what was done to repair the pistol and some help with shipping would be appreciated by the apparently many new/old owners who seem to be having problems, some of whom have now left us (or are in process of doing so). Heck, I even had a cheap little Keltec PF9 that wouldn't feed. Keltec sent me a shipping label and returned the pistol with an explanation. I sold it anyway due to the trigger pull, but it worked fine when returned. The R9 is the most comfortable carry of all of my handguns, so I do hope when it comes back it can be rehabilitated...the point I made in my letter was simply that without an explanation of what was wrong and why it won't happen again, I won't be able to trust it for carry. Since it is not a plinking pistol and since I don't keep safe queens, I would have to sell it and move on. Makes me sad 'cause I have been a true fan and an advocate to others.
Backup
I am sure Rohrbaugh will correct the problem for you.
I usually ship the guns UPS Next Day Saver. I know the added insurance can be costly. This is much less than UPS Next Day Air.
Let us know how you make out with the repair.
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Please correct me if I am mistaken but I am under the impression that if an owner ships a handgun to the factory or a repair facility it must be shipped next day air by UPS or FEDEX, for example. There are ways to skirt around this through the USPS but not all legal unless shipped FFL to FFL. Have the rules changed?
Here is my understanding on shipping firearms by non-FFL holders.
It is against the law, I am told, to ship by USPS mail. Do not do it.
It is "The Policy" of UPS and other private carriers to accept only 'Next Day' shipments. This policy went into effect because of the large number of "lost claims". These claims came about by the large number of thefts by their employees I was told by a friend who works for UPS. It would be hard for them to catch you breaking this policy and I don't know what the penaly would be.
Is it worth saving 50 bucks? I do not know.
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Actually it saved me about $90 and the item is insured for $1800. If someone wants to steal a bunch of parts to a gun that can't be trusted to fire, go for it! Next time, I'm going to talk to my gun dealer about shipping for me and see what it would cost.
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I use my FFL when I ship a gun. I pack the gun myself, he fills out the paperwork (it takes him 5 to 10 minutes), And then I take it to the post office and pay the bill. He charges me $10.00 but I normally give him $20.
I sent a Restricted Set of Seecamps to Long Island and insured them for $2500.00 for $36.00.
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A knowledgeable source just told me that there is a recent heightened awareness among the common carriers, USPS, and the BATF that is putting some teeth into illegal handgun shipping. It just isn't worth a few dollars to lose your gun, CHL/CCW, and the risk of a felony charge.
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It is not illegal to ship via UPS without overnight air....they just don't like it because of increased theft. Maria at Rohrbaugh was kind enough to send me confirmation via email today of the arrival there of my R9...hoping now to be able to trust it for carry on return, but will have to put at least 100 rounds through it first.
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I certainly did not intend to imply you did anything illegal; just a precautionary note in general from my gunsmith who ships and receives handguns on a daily basis. Also, my local UPS center will not accept a handgun shipped via ground, even though it may just be their policy.
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That's why the pistol is disassembled and sent as "machine parts". UPS knows quite well what that means as do the shippers. They probably like the business. The best deal is to ship via your FFl according to MRC, and that certainly makes sense to me. I wonder how MRC could take it to the post office to ship even with the FFL if it is illegal to ship a handgun via USPO? Someone educate me (all of the guns I have seen shipped were UPS, and I can't believe they are shipped overnight air for $90 or thereabouts). Anyway Maria got the gun and "hope is in the air!"
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This sounds like a subject best left alone rather than to explain how to game the system on this forum. Be careful out there.
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That's why the pistol is disassembled and sent as "machine parts". UPS knows quite well what that means as do the shippers. They probably like the business. The best deal is to ship via your FFl according to MRC, and that certainly makes sense to me. I wonder how MRC could take it to the post office to ship even with the FFL if it is illegal to ship a handgun via USPO? Someone educate me (all of the guns I have seen shipped were UPS, and I can't believe they are shipped overnight air for $90 or thereabouts). Anyway Maria got the gun and "hope is in the air!"
When I take the packaged firearm to the Post Office I am doing it as an agent of the FFL holder. I am just trying to save him the time and hassle.
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When I take the packaged firearm to the Post Office I am doing it as an agent of the FFL holder. I am just trying to save him the time and hassle.
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That was my question: How can an FFL holder ship a handgun via USPO if it is illegal to do so? Is there a special exclusion for FFL holders? My FFL receives and sends via UPS as far as I know, but I will ask to be sure when next I see him.
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backupr9 asked
That was my question: How can an FFL holder ship a handgun via USPO if it is illegal to do so? Is there a special exclusion for FFL holders? My FFL receives and sends via UPS as far as I know, but I will ask to be sure when next I see him.
FFL holders are allowed to ship handguns via USPS. Non licensed gun owners are not. There is a specific set of papers that the dealer fills out so when you hand it to the Postal Clerk they know it is a handgun and they then fill out their paper work.
I have a USPS receipt I found in a drawer from when I sent my Seecamp to Gouse for engraving. Postage and insurance for $900.00 cost me $16.95.
I think that most dealers use UPS or FED EX because the service is better. It can transact right in your store. My dealer always runs his own packages to the PO i know. Just my guess.
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backupr9 asked
That was my question: How can an FFL holder ship a handgun via USPO if it is illegal to do so? Is there a special exclusion for FFL holders? My FFL receives and sends via UPS as far as I know, but I will ask to be sure when next I see him.
FFL holders are allowed to ship handguns via USPS. Non licensed gun owners are not. There is a specific set of papers that the dealer fills out so when you hand it to the Postal Clerk they know it is a handgun and they then fill out their paper work.
I have a USPS receipt I found in a drawer from when I sent my Seecamp to Gouse for engraving. Postage and insurance for $900.00 cost me $16.95.
I think that most dealers use UPS or FED EX because the service is better. It can transact right in your store. My dealer always runs his own packages to the PO i know. Just my guess.
Correct. ;D
When I want a gun shipped USPS I print my USPS shipping label from my online account and take the package to my FFL and let him ship it, just need to add the transfer fee.
I think the overnight UPS and Fed-Ex rule is just another way to get into your wallet, anyone working there that is inclined to steal doesn't need a week to do it and now they know that most pistol size boxes being shipped overnight are indeed pistols. :o