Long time lurker with several ?'s

[riffraff]

Hello everyone,

I totally disagree with what has been said here and what has been passed on from some experts that one must shoot there carry gun 50-100rds a month.  Total Crap.  

If you go to the range reqularly and shoot a couple/three different handguns you will be good to go with a R9.  The R9 has very, very good natural pointing characteristics.  It simply goes to target with little effort.  That is just my personal experience, for others this may not be the case.

The fast reload/mag change issue has also been brought up.  Another magazine?  You must be kidding.  You have been watching to many movies.  If you are a Joe Citizen and you get in a situation where you fire 7 rounds and you must use another magazine I can just about guarantee you that you are going to wind up faceing charges.

Now I know that my postings tend to read differently than I intend them to read so I have to say that I mean no personal insult to anyone.  These are simply my opinions based on my life experiences.

Mike

[Brenden]

I think Brenden should experiment, since he has 4 to spare. He can afford to lose one if necessary. Brenden it is for the the good of all mankind. John

John,
 I may be willing to do so..

If you provide the ammo-115grain GDHPs preferred..

No pup is expendable in my book!!

Brenden

[BytorJr]

Well, it said I was too long winded.

I respectfully disagree that 50-100 is a load of "crap."  Go do a dynamics training class and see just how bad you begin to shoot when the old poop hits the fan.  I was run down a few times by a moving box at Tiger Valley that was made to fall down only when a CNS hit would occur.  Five rounds wasn't enough in 60% of my times at bat.  I fully missed in 20% because 5 shots wasn't enough (and I wasn't a good enough shot).

I don't carry a speed loader, and here's another reason I want (or think I do) an R9...mags are much easier and discretely carried.   This test was also carried out with full concealment.  Either in pocket or side holster, I went to side holster because in the pocket I kept drawing out the cruddy holster (a holster isssue so that's another topic).  However, Mr. Bad Boy box was around 5-7 yards when he came running at me, and since distance is your friend, you try to run away too (since in this case he had a knife or gun).  Running and shooting with somebody coming at you, while not at Carl Lewis speed, is NOT fun.  It shows how vulnerable you are.  Also, standing and letting them come at you so you can "eye them up" is not an option...I asked this, and it was demonstrated...I was toast before I even had my shirt untucked.

 Shooting static paper targets all day, with plenty of time between shots (what I'd call target shooting) is nice, but it (IMO) doesn't translate well to self defense.  Hence, this is why I'd like to be able to run at least 1 if not 2 boxes per range trip or once a month through the R9, complete with double taps and maybe even a double with a quick single.  

Before you think that shooting 7 - 14 rounds is a LOT, go take a class like this.  Before you think I'll wait until they're 3 yards from me....go get attacked by a moving box .  Don't do this for me for me, but for yourself and your country, it will open your eyes.  I too used to think...wow, how can those cops shoot 60 rounds and not hit anything but the building.....well, go dynamic and you'll see full well why.  

However, I like the idea of Brenden doing a full test.  Let's challenge him to do 600 rounds for 3 months .  

Where do you live Brenden..what part of the country.  If you're close enough, I'll volunteer..though it wouldn't be with Gold Dots (not that their is anything wrong with them)

[Hk-Itch]

I think that the R9S would do just fine for the tactical shooting class.  Yes, you might want to change out the recoil spring after completion but, I wouldn't think you would have any wear issues.  I would make sure that the weapon was reliable and broken in properly before.  Then replace the recoil spring and have at it.  Most of the early owners here where used to changing out the spring after 250 rounds anyway.

On another note, Mike brought up a valid point.  There are other ways of training with your weapon.  Dry firing for one is an excellent way to train with your gun if you don't have the time nor the funds to shoot on a regular basis.  Visualization is another great way to train,  many martial artist use visualization, meditation techniques  as a part of their training.

I don't think that shooting the R9S 50-100 rds a month is going to harm the gun.  As its already been stated here, as long as you maintain your gun and swap out the springs on a regular basis it should perform a long time for you.  

[CaptBW]

I know of one forum member (I shall not mention his name) who has put thousands of rounds through his R9 without experiencing any problems at all. I would think this is the norm.

[John]

I agree. I wonder who that guy might be Brenden I won't be sending you any ammo now to test fire your pups. I do need to know who the perp is that is shooting all these rounds.

[harrydog]

I respectfully disagree that 50-100 is a load of "crap."  

 

Me too. The more familiar you are with a particular gun, the better chances you have of not screwing up when the big adrenalin rush hits. In those circumstances, you'll need all the help you can get, along with a little luck. But I don't think you're going to convince some people of that.

[Brenden]

I agree. I wonder who that guy might be Brenden I won't be sending you any ammo now to test fire your pups. I do need to know who the perp is that is shooting all these rounds. We need to shut up some of these whinners on here.

My days of shooting 600 rounds are long gone,no wish to do so with the pup for sure..
Is anyone willing to shoot 600 with the Seecamp in .380?

IMO-If you feel you are proficient with any gun-then carry and practice as needed to keep that profientcy(sp) up..

I have not been to any "big name" schools/training classes,but I feel no less capable of protecting my family..

I have no reason to believe that there is a "Mileage" limit with the pup,to each there own on how much to shoot,clean,replace springs..
Early reccommended recoil change outs were 400 rounds-that was with the "old" type-which is what I run in my pocket pup..

Now if I am going to shoot a LOT of 9mm,I will just use this-it's a lot quicker!!

[riffraff]

Brenden,

That looks good.  Unfortunately for me I have got you beat in the "quicker" department.  My MAC 11-9 has a very high rate if fire.  Can you say "bullet hose"?  My MAC is fun but is goes through ammo like you wouldn't believe.

Mike

[Brenden]

Brenden,

That looks good.  Unfortunately for me I have got you beat in the "quicker" department.  My MAC 11-9 has a very high rate if fire.  Can you say "bullet hose"?  My MAC is fun but is goes through ammo like you wouldn't believe.

Mike

Mike,
I agree on the hose!!!

I can go a bit quicker than normal, with a change on the buffer length though!!

As an afterthought-I could have sworn that John had posted right after me with a nice Uzi shot also?? What say you? LOL..

[John]

Brenden,
             That was one of those self-destruct photos. Glad you saw it.

[riffraff]

Brendon,

I have shot UZI's.  They are OK if that is what you like.  I personally would not trade my MAC for an UZI.  The MAC is different and in my opinion better than the UZI.  Now would I trade my MAC for an MP-5, you bet I would.  Again the MP-5 is to different from a MAC or an UZI to try to make direct comparisons.  They are all very different guns.

At first I had the same feeling about the MAC as most people who do not own one:  they look ugly and they seem sort of flimsy or cheap.  The look grows on you very quickly as does the handling qualities of the gun and the absolute reliability is a big plus.  MAC's don't break.  I would bet that if someone where to shoot a MAC and an UZI side by side that given the same round count the UZI would jam or break long before the MAC.

Mike

[Brenden]

Brendon,

I have shot UZI's.  They are OK if that is what you like.  I personally would not trade my MAC for an UZI.  The MAC is different and in my opinion better than the UZI.  Now would I trade my MAC for an MP-5, you bet I would.  Again the MP-5 is to different from a MAC or an UZI to try to make direct comparisons.  They are all very different guns.

At first I had the same feeling about the MAC as most people who do not own one:  they look ugly and they seem sort of flimsy or cheap.  The look grows on you very quickly as does the handling qualities of the gun and the absolute reliability is a big plus.  MAC's don't break.  I would bet that if someone where to shoot a MAC and an UZI side by side that given the same round count the UZI would jam or break long before the MAC.

Mike

I am sorry but I have to disagree with you on the mac vs uzi reliability..
Macs break at various spots,not by my experience-others..

Da Uzi has went thru various wars-the mac has went thru-I guess I don't what??

I want a mac- so I am not against it..
Give me a Mac 9 with a Lage upper= an Uzi...

[pbwe]

thread hijack

[BytorJr]

Hijacked maybe...but a cool one .

Seriously, I doubt I'd want to shoot the pup more than 50 times per session...I can see 75; but 50 with the J-frame leaves me questioning my sanity after 1 or 2 days.  

Somebody did say that all shooting will make you more proficient, I won't disagree with that either; but nothing beats practicing with the main piece.   Take Formula 1 drivers - though they have the backup car set to the "same" settings, they never are as comfy with them...and I dare say for the most part nobody is as anal retentive as F1 Drivers.  

Oh well, I think it seems like there are more than a few folks who shoot a fair number of rounds out of their pups...this makes me feel better.  Still don't know if I'm going to jump on one....especially after being told my L3,L4,L5 disks are bulging, herniated, and ruptured with L2 having some wierd bone spur or something....I've gotta get that sorted out first before any more purchases.    


This doesn't mean I'm going to leave you guys alone though