Author Topic: Putting it back together???  (Read 3543 times)

Offline Michigunner

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Re: Putting it back together???
« Reply #15 on: January 16, 2006, 10:08:37 PM »
Right on, twostar.

Well, you know, I have read where other folks called the Magsafe rounds "devastating".

They seem to be rather highly regarded.

I'm going to carry each bunch for maybe six months, and then fill up with new ones.

I was glad to see that you like them, too.

Bill

Offline sslater

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Re: Putting it back together???
« Reply #16 on: January 16, 2006, 10:49:21 PM »
JYogi:
I've been using skateboard tape on my R9S for several months now with absolutely no issues.  The gun can't hang up while drawing.  Don't see how it could, really.  Tape on the front- and backstraps will be covered by your hand when you "grab onto the handle".  Ditto for the sides of the grip - though I don't use any tape on the sides.

I have strong hands, but the gun is small and tends to get slippery from the lubricants used on the innards.

Some day after my gun gets beat up-looking from daily carry I'll send it off to Robar for stippling and refinishing with their NP3 or Rogard finish.  I wish Rohrbaugh offered stippling or checkering as an option.


Offline R9SCarry

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Re: Putting it back together???
« Reply #17 on: January 16, 2006, 11:00:53 PM »
Steve - I do think one day they will offer stippling/chequering - but for short term future it is all about guns out the door I think! :)
Chris - R9S
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Offline sslater

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Re: Putting it back together???
« Reply #18 on: January 16, 2006, 11:40:35 PM »
Twostar & Michigunner,
I don't want to get into a big argument about which round is the best for self defense carry, but the Glaser & Magsafe ammo is not well regarded by the FBI, Dr. Martin Fackler, or Duncan MacPherson.

The FBI study I'm referring to is:

Firearms Tactical Institute
 
Work of the U.S. Government; not subject to copyright in the United States.
 
Web Site Index and Navigation Center
U.S. Department of Justice
Handgun Wounding Factors and Effectiveness
Special Agent UREY W. PATRICK
FIREARMS TRAINING UNIT
FBI ACADEMY
QUANTICO, VIRGINIA
July 14, 1989

From page 5:
Mechanics of Handgun Wounding
All handgun wounds will combine the components of penetration, permanent cavity, and temporary cavity to a greater or lesser degree. Fragmentation, on the other hand, does not reliably occur in handgun wounds due to the relatively low velocities of handgun bullets. Fragmentation occurs reliably in high velocity projectile wounds (impact velocity in excess of 2000 feet per second) inflicted by soft or hollow point bullets.10 In such a case, the permanent cavity is stretched so far, and so fast, that tearing and rupturing can occur in tissues surrounding the wound channel which were weakened by fragmentation damage.11,12 It can significantly increase damage13 in rifle bullet wounds.
Since the highest handgun velocities generally do not exceed 1400-1500 feet per second (fps) at the muzzle, reliable fragmentation could only be achieved by constructing a bullet so frangible as to eliminate any reasonable penetration. Unfortunately, such a bullet will break up too fast to penetrate to vital organs. The best example is the Glaser Safety Slug, a projectile designed to break up on impact and generate a large but shallow temporary cavity. Fackler, when asked to estimate the survival time of someone shot in the front mid-abdomen with a Glaser slug, responded, "About three days, and the cause of death would be peritonitis."14  (My emphasis - SS.)  In cases where some fragmentation has occurred in handgun wounds, the bullet fragments are generally found within one centimeter of the permanent cavity. "The velocity of pistol bullets, even of the new high-velocity loadings, is insufficient to cause the shedding of lead fragments seen with rifle bullets."15  It is obvious that any additional wounding effect caused by such fragmentation in a handgun wound is inconsequential.
Of the remaining factors, temporary cavity is frequently, and grossly, overrated as a wounding factor when analyzing wounds.16   Nevertheless, historically it has been used in some cases as the primary means of assessing the wounding effectiveness of bullets.


Dr. Fackler, a former U.S. Military trauma surgeon, is one of the foremost wound experts in the world.  Duncan MacPherson is a real rocket scientist who worked with Dr. Fackler on the math / physics behind the wounding mechanisms that Dr. Fackler observed in his medical practice.  MacPherson wrote THE seminal text on the subject, Bullet Penetration  Modeling the Dynamics and Incapacitation Resulting from Wound Trauma.  I finally got a copy.  It's a mathematically rigerous study, and tough reading for someone who graduated from engineering school in 1965.  Basically it discounts most of what we read from the gun magazines, and debunks "kinetic energy dump", "hydrostatic shock", Taylor K.O. formula, Sanow's works.  All the relatively easy-to- understand intuitive stuff. ???
Anyway,  as I said earlier, I don't want to get into a big wrangle over this stuff.  And I did carry Glaser Safety Slugs as the first two rounds iin my magazines.  Then I read some b.s. in a couple of magazines that convinced me to study the available literature and sort the wheat from the chaff.  Draw your own conclusions......

Offline R9SCarry

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Re: Putting it back together???
« Reply #19 on: January 16, 2006, 11:48:09 PM »
It has long struck me Steve that anything overly frangible is not gonna be that useful.

I always accept that a HP might ''clog'' with fabric but even so the bullet will achieve something like useful penetration.

I have heard ''rave'' reviews about ultra light Zn bullets but frankly - I'll stick to what I have confidence in - as well as pretty much using stuff the legal eagles can't call anything too evil!!
Chris - R9S
Guns don't kill people - people kill people.
R9 FAQ Site
NRA Life member and Certified Instructor.

Offline Michigunner

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Re: Putting it back together???
« Reply #20 on: January 17, 2006, 12:16:30 AM »
Steve,

You got me concerned now.  I'll have to think more about this important topic.

Thanks for posting that.

I was a little worried about not using common, ordinary ammunition.

Bill


Offline Brenden

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Re: Putting it back together???
« Reply #21 on: January 17, 2006, 06:56:45 PM »
Personally, I am not overly concerned with carrying "ball" ammo at the moment!! :o

I am currently experiencing snow and ice..

Everyone is wearing HEAVY coats..

Therefore,ball may penetrate and work fine..

Of course I would not worry about HPs either..

If the don't expand or open properly,I am sure they will not go unoticed by the BG.. ;)

I know that I would not want to stand in front of either,no matter if I was wearing 2 jackets and 3 sweaters!! ;D

This being said-my pup has STHPs in at the moment and my G26 has WWB 115 "ball".. :D

Brenden
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