Author Topic: Anyone else have this R9 problem?  (Read 8786 times)

Offline backupr9

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Anyone else have this R9 problem?
« on: October 02, 2011, 03:40:39 PM »
Fired new Covert last week which seemed to have significantly more recoil than my R9S.  The inside right part of the front of the trigger guard kept slapping the inside of the first joint of my trigger finger and blistered it....never had that problem with the R9.  Went back today with a glove and still painful in the same place, even with slightly different grip styles, one and two hand.  There also seemed to be a longer trigger reset on this pistol than on my other.
1.  Could the interior coating in some fashion be transferring more of the recoil to the grip, or changing the angle of the recoil?
2.  I haven't changed the spring since there have only now been 70 rounds fired...I'll change it when cleaning it today anyway since I guess this could be the problem.

Anyone else notice this problem?  Suggestions?  (and no, I can't keep the R9S...unfortunately just sold it to afford the Covert).
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Offline Reinz

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Re: Anyone else have this R9 problem?
« Reply #1 on: October 02, 2011, 04:42:53 PM »
Wow backup9, what a puzzle.

The only thing I can say is tear the mechanics down.


Breeak everything down that you can and see if you can find any changes what so ever, no matter how insignificant they may sound.

Have you changed your shooting stance ?, Your ammo ?,(did any +P slip in the batch?)
 Are the grips different at all ?  Mag extension ?

Are you holding the gun out at the same arms length as before ?
Same eye level ?

Gun wise just to check the timing, is the ammo 100 %  fully chambered , for 100% lock up so it is not firing out of battery ?

When you tore it down to clean, does it have a new style recoil spring ? (closed loop both ends) If not, could it be in backwards ?

While gun is apart, do a function check on the recoil rod assembly.


Sorry for the stooopid questions, but we gotta start somewhere.

Good Luck
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Offline yankee2500

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Re: Anyone else have this R9 problem?
« Reply #2 on: October 02, 2011, 06:10:03 PM »
If Reins hash't covered it with his post it may never be solved. :D
Very thoroughly covered.
« Last Edit: October 02, 2011, 06:10:43 PM by yankee2500 »
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Offline kjtrains

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Re: Anyone else have this R9 problem?
« Reply #3 on: October 02, 2011, 06:13:52 PM »
Good job, Reinz!    :)
Let us have faith that right makes might, and in that faith, let us, to the end, dare to do our duty as we understand it.  Abraham Lincoln

Offline backupr9

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Re: Anyone else have this R9 problem?
« Reply #4 on: October 02, 2011, 09:00:17 PM »
Thanks Reinz, answers as follows:

1.  No change in shooting stance...fired modified Weaver and single hand (right).
2.  Using John's curved grip extension which pushes my hand up into the trigger guard, but today deliberately dropped little and ring fingers under the extensioin...may have helped but already have 2nd degree skin loss on the trigger finger which still hurt in spite of glove when firing.  I plan to order straight extensions when available.
3.  Used a variety of ammo:  124 gold dots, 115 remington (continue to need double strikes due to hard primers...these were the UMC hardball); some federal and Winchester white box.  NO +P USED.
4.  After first firing the other day, tore it down...usual wear areas more evident because of the Covert finish, but nothing to worry about.  The spring came with the pistol which has Serial #57xx, so should be new (is new style, closed on both ends).
5.  Recoil rod assy. seemed normal.  Required the same pressure to shorten it during re-assembly.
6.  Lock up is fine...fires predictably and accurately with good ammo but is eating my hand up.  Trigger may be set a little further forward in the guard than the R9S, but if so, not by much.
7.  The Covert finish has a very fine roughness, perhaps like 800 grit sand paper (?)...could be the problem I guess.

I'll change the spring when I clean, wait until the finger heals and try it out again with a glove and bandaid in place.

ANY COVERT OWNERS OUT THERE WITH A SIMILAR PROBLEM?
"Those who would sacrifice a little freedom for a little order, will lose both, and deserve neither." 
Thomas Jefferson

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Offline sslater

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Re: Anyone else have this R9 problem?
« Reply #5 on: October 02, 2011, 10:12:01 PM »
Since you've already gone thru Reinz's check list, you need to try a back-to-back session with a 'vanilla' R9.
That's the first step of the old Pratt & Whitney engineering substitution method of problem diagnostics.  (I don't think I'd want to be swapping individual components between two R9s, though.)

If you know anyone with a plain R9, I'd suggest going to the range together and switching guns for your normal-length shooting session.
 If your finger gets beat up with the plain R9, the problem is with you.
 If your finger feels good and your shooting buddy's finger is beat up, the issue is with the Covert.
 Etc., etc.



Offline backupr9

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Re: Anyone else have this R9 problem?
« Reply #6 on: October 03, 2011, 10:29:22 AM »
Actually, I have an R9S and have fired it recently and many tiimes over the past 18 months without ever experiencing this problem.  I'll take the Covert down again, change the spring and see what happens.  Perceived recoil is just so much greater with the Covert.
"Those who would sacrifice a little freedom for a little order, will lose both, and deserve neither." 
Thomas Jefferson

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Offline Reinz

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Re: Anyone else have this R9 problem?
« Reply #7 on: October 03, 2011, 02:06:59 PM »
Well, we are narrowing things down.  

Like you said, next, let the finger heal.

I like sslater's idea just to be thorough, but if you are confident, I understand.


You might be on to something if the trigger stroke is longer, that could cause you to reposition you grip just enough to cause the problem.


How about on the next breakdown, pull the trigger out and inspect  the pivot point area and in the frame area as well.  Look for that roughness you are talking about.
It may need some gentle polishing.

Look the trigger bar over real well and look for wear marks on it and drag marks on the frame.

From here I would go to the mainspring.  Keep in mind, someone else besides the factory tore into this gun.
The mainspring may have been contaminated with trash or dried up coating.  Which may contribute to multiple firing pin strikes as well.

It would be nice if you could try another Covert for sure.


Good Luck
« Last Edit: October 03, 2011, 02:08:08 PM by Reinz »
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Offline tracker

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Re: Anyone else have this R9 problem?
« Reply #8 on: October 03, 2011, 03:29:52 PM »
Reinz makes a point that occurred to me also that a third party,  presumably Wilson, had a part in this gun. According to a dealer the Covert is covered under warranty by Rohrbaugh. If that is the case you might call them and save yourself some angst and aggravation.



"Rohrbaugh "COVERT", In cooperation with Wilson and Rohrbaugh we are happy to be the exclusive dealer for this pistol. This gun is fully warrantied by Rohrbaugh. A Rohrbaugh R9S in 9mm, Black Wilson Armor Tuff finish on entire gun including the trigger, hammer, and magazine. This pistol will not rust! In addition, Wilson Combat reworked the action by smoothing out internal parts and re-contoured the trigger - making a lighter double action trigger pull. Plus Neil Hogue custom checkered G10 grips. Comes with plastic carry case, manual, two magazines, extra spring, spent cartridge case,and lock.

We are the sole distributor of this gun.

Ship to FFL holder only. Free shipping and insurance."
« Last Edit: October 03, 2011, 05:23:08 PM by tracker »

Offline backupr9

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Re: Anyone else have this R9 problem?
« Reply #9 on: October 03, 2011, 06:12:51 PM »
Thanks folks.  Cleaned, inspected today.   Only 65+ rounds on the spring that came with the pistol, but I changed to the other mainspring that came with it.  Interestingly, the new one was 1/3" longer and looked a tiny amount bigger in diameter, but not too much different from some of my other reserve springs.  I can't find anything else different.  The curved grip extension is the only new issue and does change my grip, so I plan to fire it tomorrow without that, and to shoot a friend's plane Jane R9 with it (I just sold my two-tone to a forum member and unfortunately it's packed to ship, but a buddy is kind enough to lend me his).

I'll let you know.  Will heavily bandage the trigger finger tomorrow!!!
"Those who would sacrifice a little freedom for a little order, will lose both, and deserve neither." 
Thomas Jefferson

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Offline yankee2500

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Re: Anyone else have this R9 problem?
« Reply #10 on: October 03, 2011, 06:17:34 PM »
No liability is expressed or implied with the use of yankee mag extensions.   ;D ;D

Hope you get it worked out. :D
"THE KING OF BATTLE"


"Cha togar m' fhearg gun dìoladh"

"The beauty of the second amendment is that it will not be needed until they try to take it."
Thomas Jefferson

Offline tracker

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Re: Anyone else have this R9 problem?
« Reply #11 on: October 03, 2011, 06:37:49 PM »

Those mag extensions are benefit only as far as I am concerned.

Offline yankee2500

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Re: Anyone else have this R9 problem?
« Reply #12 on: October 03, 2011, 07:25:34 PM »
Thanks tracker, I have to agree. ;D
"THE KING OF BATTLE"


"Cha togar m' fhearg gun dìoladh"

"The beauty of the second amendment is that it will not be needed until they try to take it."
Thomas Jefferson

Offline kjtrains

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Re: Anyone else have this R9 problem?
« Reply #13 on: October 03, 2011, 07:59:49 PM »
Quote
Thanks folks.  Cleaned, inspected today.   Only 65+ rounds on the spring that came with the pistol, but I changed to the other mainspring that came with it.  Interestingly, the new one was 1/3" longer and looked a tiny amount bigger in diameter, but not too much different from some of my other reserve springs.  I can't find anything else different.  The curved grip extension is the only new issue and does change my grip, so I plan to fire it tomorrow without that, and to shoot a friend's plane Jane R9 with it (I just sold my two-tone to a forum member and unfortunately it's packed to ship, but a buddy is kind enough to lend me his).

I'll let you know.  Will heavily bandage the trigger finger tomorrow!!!

John.  Get some more healing time on that finger before shooting again; even heavily bandaged your awareness will still be more acute; my thoughts; unless you can shoot with the other hand.  
Let us have faith that right makes might, and in that faith, let us, to the end, dare to do our duty as we understand it.  Abraham Lincoln

Offline backupr9

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Re: Anyone else have this R9 problem?
« Reply #14 on: October 03, 2011, 09:33:30 PM »
Thanks KJ, good advice.  
John (Yankee), no intended blame...I have relatively small hands and tried to crowd the whole four fingers above the curved extension which may have caused the problem.  I've done some practice with a snap cap and found a really comfortable way of curling the pinkie under the extension that actually seems to add good support.  I still want to be on your list for a black straight extension when you resume selling.
"Those who would sacrifice a little freedom for a little order, will lose both, and deserve neither." 
Thomas Jefferson

Endur Fortis