New R9s owner

[harrydog]

I was referring to different steel, different chamber, loosened tolerances, different spring twist.  All appear to be minor "tweeks" but they are small changes.  I am mostly interested in why they changed to material used to manufacture the guns with, this seems the biggest change.

I can only speculate but I would think the change from 17-4 to 416 stainless was done because 416 is easier to machine than 17-4 and I would assume this saves them time and money.
I guess that 416 is adequate for the job but I liked the idea of a 17-4 slide since it is a stronger material and made the R9 that much more special. Unfortunately the price of the R9 is going up as the cost of materials (416 and G10) is going down.

[mdpetrasek]

That was my suspicion as well.  If they are not careful they will find themselves in the uneviable position of losing customers.  I really like the carbon fiber grips I see posted as well.  But they are no more I see.  I think if they make too many more changes to "cheapen" the gun while extracting larger profits, it will cut into demand I would think.  I was wondering if someone is a true expert could chime in and let us know their thoughts.  Thanks.

[theirishguard]

mdpetrasek, I must disagree with you. You are new to the forum and Rohrbaugh, I don't think you have enough knowledge to pass judgement on Rohbaugh as a company or the quality of the R9s. I suggest you hang around awhile, read and shoot one before you continue to make incorrect statements.   Tom

[mdpetrasek]

Tell me what statements I am making that are incorrect.  Yes I am new to the forum and trying to obtain more information.  If you have some information to impart I suggest you do.  Otherwise, I dont appreciate you coming up just shy of calling me a liar.  All the information I posted is freely available on the forums, I am just wondering why they are making the changes they are.  If they are good changes, great.  I just am curious as a new future owner.  Its called curiosity and a geniune interest in this product.  There is not a lot of info out there and even fewer reviews.  I have read all I believe available, and its mostly positive.  I am more curious as to the changes being made to the product though.  As you are a seemingly well versed individual on this product, how about actually giving a new guy some productive information?

[ccoorreeyy]

mdpetrasek I suggest you call Karl Rohrbaugh (1-800-803-2233)and ask him your questions.  Information straight from the horses mouth will all ways trump speculation.  Good luck on your quest.
Corey

[mdpetrasek]

Yes, he sounds like a nice fellow with a great reputation.  I would hate to bother the guy though when hopefully someone here has the insights.  A lot of folks here seemingly know everything about the company and products, was just hoping for their comments.  I appreciate everyones kind words, with the exception of one, and will post a unbiased range report when my new "toy" arrives.  One question, why does everyone call it a pup, little dog with big bite, or something else?  Thanks, mp.

[tracker]

As far as I am concerned, the newer generation slides are
superb and just as good as the older models, if not better.
They were and still are excellent but Rohrbaugh is also an
evolutionary company: they are always trying to improve the
product. I am certainly not a metallurgist but from a functional
and structural integrity point of view, the new slides are
outstanding. Their customer service, as has been repeated
many times before here, is without peer. The internals of the
gun, such as extractors, ejectors, etc., are also on the posi-
tive slope of functionality. There is, in my opinion, no effort
to put them "on the cheap" at Rohrbaugh, quite the opposite.

[mdpetrasek]

here is some info I found on stainless steel - first the newer steel used in the firearm

Grade 416 has the highest machinability of any stainless steel, at about 85% of that of a free-machining carbon steel. As for most other free-machining stainless steels the improvement in machinability is achieved by addition of sulphur which forms manganese sulphide inclusions; this sulphur addition also lowers the corrosion resistance, weldability and formability to below that of its non-free machining equivalent Grade 410.

Grade 416 is sometimes used in the unhardened or hardened and highly tempered condition because of its low cost and ready machinability.

Martensitic stainless steels are optimised for high hardness, and other properties are to some degree compromised. Fabrication must be by methods that allow for poor weldability and usually also allow for a final harden and temper heat treatment. Corrosion resistance is lower than the common austenitic grades, and their useful operating temperature range is limited by their loss of ductility at sub-zero temperatures and loss of strength by over-tempering at elevated temperatures.


Now the steel they used to use -

Stainless steel grade 17-4, a chromium-nickel-copper stainless steel, maintains high strength up to a temperature of approximately 600° F and provides a level of corrosion resistance that surpasses the 400 series of stainless steels. 17-4 Stainless Steel has a martensitic structure in the annealed condition and requires a low temperature treatment to sustain a higher level of strength.

I am sorry to disagree, but it seems the new steel is inferior to the old.  If you research it, 416 is a less desirable, less expensive, but easier to work with steel.  

Any comments from anyone?  Just trying to get a discussion going, not to bash this product.  

[theirishguard]

You stated that Rohrbaugh is making changes that cheapen the pistol. I don't think you know enough about the pistol to make that statement. The C/F grips were hard to get because of aerospace demands & etc and it was holding up delivery of pistols to dealers and customers. Again I believe you would be satified more in calling Karl Rohrbaugh and discussing your concerns whether than posting statements that might not be true as tho they were. You don't even have the pistol yet and are making comments that the company is cheapening the product to make more money. That statement is way out of line. Get the R9 and shoot it then see where you are. I am not calling you a liar just not fully informed. Tom

[mdpetrasek]

Wow, back to the liar liar pants on fire retort.  Thanks Irish guy for your comment.  Anyways, I am just researching the product and posting FACTS.  I said they were using products that would "cheapen" the gun.  As you may not be aware of when words are italicized they can have different meanings or emphasis is place on the word.  In this instance I meant it is cheaper for the company to use these products.  I said they switched materials around and am just curious as to why.  And for the record, just because its cheaper does not mean it does not work, I see this in my practice daily.  So Irish guy, relax, its just a forum.  I hope you're not this serious in real life.  Good to know about the carbon fiber grips, still prefer them to current grips, they looked much...more unique and well....expensive.  Instead of chastising people, you should be trying to educate and discuss things without getting tweaked.  I have been nothing but respectful in this forum, yet I get the feeling Irish guy is getting close to banning me.  Just a hunch.  And as far as me posting things that may not be true, please tell me otherwise, I am here to learn and have asked for your input prior, just request you be a little less nasty.  I have only reported what I have read ON THIS FORUM....

[tracker]

One more comment on the steel business. It may be that one
has better metalurgical qualities than the other but they are
both excellent. I don't particularly care as long it has structu-
ral integrity.  I have heard of no slide cracks in a long time
and I think those very few incidents had to do with a bad
batch of barstock.

[mdpetrasek]

good to know, thanks.  i read about a couple of cracked slides, nice to hear its isolated.  there may very well be a good reason to switch steel.  the "better" steel may be less desirable in the gun business, seems common in the aerospace industry, though that does not mean all steel is appropriate in all industries. does anyone know anything about the "diamond" coating on the elite models?  is this anything like tennifer or is it something entirely different?  i heard smith and wesson applies it, is this true?

[ccoorreeyy]

I have been nothing but respectful in this forum, yet I get the feeling Irish guy is getting close to banning me.

"Irish guy" is Tom Watson.  There is NO ONE that has had more Rohrbaugh pistols gone through their hands than Tom (other than the people at the Rohrbaugh factory).  That makes Tom is kinda like an elder to the Rohrbaugh name and this forum.   Giving/calling him nick names is not respectful in my book.  I understand having questions, but I don't understand having an attitude.  I may be reading into it to deep and if thats the case i'm sorry.  Your still welcome here anytime and I still hope you get answers to all your questions.

[theirishguard]

all I'm saying is get your pistol, hold it and look at it. I think you'll find it well made. Then take it to the range and shoot it, it should be the pocket pistol of your dreams. Making statements on limited info doesn't really have much value. Putting down the pistol and company based on little information and experience seems silly and makes one wonder why you are making those statements. Maybe you are doubting your decision to buy one.? It seems strange to me that you come on the forum, tell us about buying a Stealth for $1400 and then wonder if you made a good buying decision. I know in your mind you felt you asked a question about changes and quality, but then you answer those questions with data that may be wrong. Again call Karl Rohrbaugh and ask him or PM me with your phone number and I'll ask Karl to call you. Tom

[EMT]

Hey Guys.  Since you're discussing CF grips....  what is the current grip material?  When did they change?  Advantages other than cosmetic?  Same hold true for the aluminum grips.. cosmetic only?   I bought an R9 Stealth sight unseen and am VERY pleased with it.  

mdpetrasek,  I hope you enjoy you new R9 when you receive it.  If not,  you will have no trouble selling it for what you paid.  Rohrbaughs command, and rightfully so, a high resale value.  If the Rohrbaugh is not to you liking, Seecamp makes a total SS true pocket pistol in .32 and .380.  NAA does the same though they are not the equal of the Seecamps.  Regardless,  welcome to the forum.  

EMT