The Rohrbaugh Forum

Miscellaneous => Other Guns => Topic started by: whkrog on March 07, 2010, 07:34:24 PM

Title: SigSauer - What's Going On?
Post by: whkrog on March 07, 2010, 07:34:24 PM: A rewording of a line from Shakespeare's Henry II Act III Scene II:
"For God's sake, let us sit upon the ground and tell sad stories of the death of SIGs".
OK, the word should be 'Kings' but recent events have made me wonder.
First, I own two SigSauer pistols, a P250 compact and a full-size classic P226. (And I love my Rohrbaugh R9s). But here's the story. My P250 bought 3 months ago has always worked perfectly and is extremely accurate. My sister and brother-in-law were looking for a semi-auto 9mm pistol and after trying perhaps a dozen different makes/models, also like the P250 compact (with medium grips) since it fit both their hands and styles best.
After ordering, waiting and received theirs, we all went on to shooting. Soon found out two interesting things: SIG had in a short time and without any notice to dealers, accessory manufacturers, etc. significantly changed the design: First, accessories (like my LaserMax laser sight and StreamLight tactical light) which USED to fit on the rail, can no longer can be mounted since SIG changed the curvature and depth of the grooves on what they advertise as a Picatinny rail. Second, all the magazines -- including those being sold everywhere by dealers -- for the new designs are NOT
compatible with the older ones; and SigSauer did not notify anyone of the changes, nor did they change the dealer part numbers. They kept the part number and
are now shipping magazines in the same plastic boxes, with just a small paper sticker on them saying 'new'.
I checked with LaserMax and they were likewise unaware of the changes, and thus that they were selling accessories which would no longer fit the P250. "Let the Buyer Beware".
As for SIG, after spending more than an hour on hold, their Customer Service Representative stated that the changes in the rail were made to 'go back to the original Picatinny rail design'). I think this answer was and is nothing but PR "Corpspeak".
The design standard for the Picatinny rail (MIL-STD-1913 REV A) was last changed on 10 JUNE 1999. STANAG 2324 was and is just an official adoption of this design. This standard specifies precisely the cross-section of the rail body and the spacing, width and depth of the grooves. So either their original implementation on the 'Handgun of the Year' was incorrect, or the current one is incorrect, or -- possibly -- neither is compliant. Which is it?
Then, my sister's SIG P250 failed permanently (trigger mechanism failure - weapon would not load or fire) after about 200 rounds, requiring it to be sent back to SIG for repair/replacement.
Second incident: while sister was still waiting for her SIG to be returned (don't bother trying to call SIG's customer service line: even the dealers
have to give up after an hour or so on hold), I sent my P226 back the the SIG Custom Shop for two things: to have new Meprolite Night Sights installed (this was done correctly) and for a 'Trigger Enhancement Package' designed to smooth out and somewhat equalize the DA/SA trigger pulls.
On receipt of my P226, I shipped it to Bob Cogan [of Accurate Plating and Weaponry/Cogan's Custom Shop (http://www.apwcogan.com)] for plating and some other work.
He immediately phoned me and told me that this pistol had been rendered Single-Action-Only and was extremely dangerous. The SIG armorer had returned the pistol as 'job completed and tested' when it actually would not cock and lock back the hammer when the slide was pulled.
You could manually cock the hammer back on a chambered round, but the trigger pull couldn't even be measured: it was on the order of a few ounces.
Dangerous? You bet. Anyway, Mr. Cogan took on the fight with SigSauer, and basically sent it back to SIG, where they returned the pistol back to
him, with a new, unmodified stock trigger system. Did I mention I'd already paid SigSauer for the 'upgrade'?
At any rate, Mr. Cogan will now and in future do all the work on my hanguns, and I will leave the people in Exeter, NH behind forever.
Having lived in Switzerland for several years in the late 1990's and used their products there, I've always had an admiration for the quality of their work and their attention to design mechanics. Perhaps this is still the case, a few instances do not make a damning case against an entire large company -- I can personally state, however, that their 'customer service' in multiple cases here seems to be pretty lacking.
Title: Re: SigSauer - What's Going On?
Post by: tracker on March 07, 2010, 08:02:34 PM: whkrog;

Although I own several Sigs made in Germany my gunsmith alerted me to a possible compromise in quality a couple of years ago. Against his advice I bought a Sig Mosquito and traded it two days later for a Glock after one unpleasant range experience.
Something is severely amiss at Sig.
Title: Re: SigSauer - What's Going On?
Post by: whkrog on March 07, 2010, 10:13:26 PM: Indeed, it appears to me that 'something is going on' and likely it is not for the best, as far as consumers are concerned. Personally and at this time, I feel no inclination towards purchasing any of their existing or upcoming products, and will no longer send any of my SIG arms to the manufacturer for work -- I'll let Bob Cogan (a master, and a truly and really good person) do this work now and in the future.
I'm interested if anyone else has had experiences like this, although I realize this is a rather limited forum.
Title: Re: SigSauer - What's Going On?
Post by: ccoorreeyy on March 07, 2010, 10:30:36 PM: I have a couple experiences in Bob doing TOP SHELF work for me but dont have any Sig experiences.
Title: Re: SigSauer - What's Going On?
Post by: Chief-USN on March 11, 2010, 08:22:12 AM: I have a 20 year old Sig 228 that has many thousands of rounds through it. No problems, and still accurate. I also carried a 228 prior to buying one for myself. Glad you told us all this about the new guns.

Chief
Title: Re: SigSauer - What's Going On?
Post by: Dino on March 11, 2010, 09:49:49 AM: Whkrog, Sig did post the changes to the grip and the mag on the website when they made the changes. I printed and kept the post as I knew one day it would cause me problems with my compact P250. You can go to the Sig website and look under, "Product Alerts", and print if you like.

https://www.sigsauer.com/CustomerService/Product-Alerts.aspx

One another note I like the new grip and they sell them for $45, however you are right I would have to buy a new mag also.

If your sister would like the old style grip mine is as new and she is welcome to it along with my mag if she wanted to trade.

I will not hang a light on mine so it does not make any differance to me.

I have a subcompact 357 conversion kit on order from Sig and will not use the light rail on that configuration, if it ever arrives.

Sorry to here about your problems with your 250 hope you have better luck in the future.
Title: Re: SigSauer - What's Going On?
Post by: sslater on March 12, 2010, 12:12:39 AM: Whkrog,

I'm sorry to hear SigSauer is going downhill. Sounds like they're on the Colt trajectory.

I have a Sig P239 in .40 S&W, and it has been terrific. Totally reliable, accurate, handy size. When I got it about 4 or 5 years ago, I had to take it to the local police department for the "safety check" (requirement since dropped). A detective walked by, looked at my gun and said, "239. Good gun. That's what I carry." And he pulled back his suit coat to show it to me. That made my day.

Your sister's problems with her P250 bother me because I've had my eye on one of those modular wonders since they hit the market. The thought of having a convertible pistol appeals to me. Guess I'll wait and see if Sig shakes off their slump.

Steve
Title: Re: SigSauer - What's Going On?
Post by: whkrog on March 12, 2010, 02:28:56 AM: Other than what has been previously mentioned, SIG has come out with a new product (you can only find it if you look for 'new procucts' on theie website: "The P20 2SUM): so now in abox you can by TWO of the different sized P50's, and a great discount. This tends of couse to p**s off the customers in the few months before this 'offer' who paid full dealer price for only ONE P25); actual example::; $654.00 for one P250 conpact, versus $759 for TWO GUNS -- the same P20 compact AND a subcompact or full size.
Smeone might was to tell the people in NH, that Americans don't really appreciate to be hosed like this, and we do tend to remember.Oh, refunds on the diffence? NOPE.
Title: Re: SigSauer - What's Going On?
Post by: Dino on March 12, 2010, 08:30:18 AM: Well said Whkrog, just like me, paid $650 for my P250 compact and now have a subcompact conversion on order for $375, do the math.

Bad news, I placed the order for the 357sig conversion in November and was told I might get it by or just after Christmas.

Maybe I should drop the order?
Title: Re: SigSauer - What's Going On?
Post by: kjtrains on March 12, 2010, 11:22:28 AM: Dino. That is a long wait. Maybe you could ask them what the holdup is? You may have done that; just a thought.
Title: Re: SigSauer - What's Going On?
Post by: whkrog on March 19, 2010, 09:36:06 PM: On a happier note, I received my SIG P226 back from AP&W today. (http://www.apwcogan.com).
It used to be a good pistol.
Now it's a great pistol, and a work of art also.
(http://1.bp.blogspot.com/_LCe3yw4OdMw/S6QWiMju30I/AAAAAAAAAeM/6ZLDcG1JWhA/s1600/AP%26W%2BP226%2Bsmall_2.jpg)
Title: Re: SigSauer - What's Going On?
Post by: kjtrains on March 19, 2010, 09:41:49 PM: That is an excellent looking Sig!
Title: Re: SigSauer - What's Going On?
Post by: Richard S on March 20, 2010, 10:22:46 AM: Quote
On a happier note, I received my SIG P226 back from AP&W today. (http://www.apwcogan.com).
It used to be a good pistol.
Now it's a great pistol, and a work of art also.
(http://1.bp.blogspot.com/_LCe3yw4OdMw/S6QWiMju30I/AAAAAAAAAeM/6ZLDcG1JWhA/s1600/AP%26W%2BP226%2Bsmall_2.jpg)

That beauty really shows off Bob Cogan's touch. Congratulations!
Title: Re: SigSauer - What's Going On?
Post by: Reinz on March 20, 2010, 07:57:24 PM: Whkrog - what a beauty! Thanks for sharing, and updating us on the new hosing of Sig.

While admitting to being an owner of at least 4 Sigs, I have succombed to the "in vogue" pistols of the day and purchased some Sigs; only to be disappointed and going limp.

They just can't get the rise that a good quality 1911 will bring,
Or Rohrbaugh!

But I do admit Sig did get it right with the X-5 series of 226's.
Those are a different animal that I do like, while pricey.

The new news that you bring now totally turns me off to all Sig products if that is how they treat their customers and market their products.

Reinz
Title: Re: SigSauer - What's Going On?
Post by: tracker on March 20, 2010, 09:24:22 PM: Everything considered, nothing shoots and feels better than a good 1911, new, old, or otherwise.
Title: Re: SigSauer - What's Going On?
Post by: whkrog on March 21, 2010, 12:07:38 AM: It looks like I may not get to the range to shoot the P226 for a least a week. :(
I will post a range report when I do. The trigger action -- which SIG hosed up, and then just returned to standard factory -- was incredibly improved by AP&W. As a result of these rather eye-opening experiences, should I ever need any work done on either SIG, I know where I'll send it, and a hint is: it's not in New Hampshire.
In a flurry of pistol-related expeditures which are most probably ill-advised at this time (but against the temptation I seem completely helpless), AP&W now has my Rohrbaugh R9s, to do a 'Corey' on it, if that is a verb.
I have a dear friend who has three pairs of expensive Oakley sunglasses. It is my full intention to always own more handguns than he has Oakleys, so some time in the not too distant future. it will be necessary to buy another, to keep the edge over him. At the risk of starting an overhwhelming firestorm of controversy over a subject likely never to be resolved:
if I were to go forth and seek a 1911, and be comfortable with one I could purchase as a factory model and not spend anything for a year (OK, maybe six months) on modifying, what might that be and why?
I will now duck and cover.
Title: Re: SigSauer - What's Going On?
Post by: tracker on March 21, 2010, 01:01:41 AM: Here we go.
Title: Re: SigSauer - What's Going On?
Post by: kjtrains on March 21, 2010, 08:10:48 AM: Quote
Everything considered, nothing shoots and feels better than a good 1911, new, old, or otherwise.

I really like mine, as well; and the R9.
Title: Re: SigSauer - What's Going On?
Post by: kjtrains on March 21, 2010, 08:16:14 AM: whkrog. Go ahead and get the 1911. You'll like it for sure.
Title: Re: SigSauer - What's Going On?
Post by: Reinz on March 21, 2010, 10:55:23 AM: Quote
Everything considered, nothing shoots and feels better than a good 1911, new, old, or otherwise.

Amen brother!

Once you try a good one, Gold Cup or even better; like a custom Wilson. Baer. Brown.etc. everthing else is just "ok".
You'll never be satisfied with anything else either.

Reinz
Title: Re: SigSauer - What's Going On?
Post by: kjtrains on March 21, 2010, 12:21:27 PM: I'm for the Ed Brown, of course!
Title: Re: SigSauer - What's Going On?
Post by: whkrog on March 21, 2010, 12:41:00 PM: Oh. man, you guys are messing me up. Now I suppose I'll have to go out and get a white Lamborghini Gallardo Spyder convertible, to carry my Ed Brown in its custom-made carrier in the trunk...
Title: Re: SigSauer - What's Going On?
Post by: kjtrains on March 21, 2010, 12:46:51 PM: Let's stick to guns! ;D ;D
Title: Re: SigSauer - What's Going On?
Post by: Richard S on March 21, 2010, 12:48:45 PM: I hear you can get a Lambo with a special leather-lined compartment in the driver's side door molded specifically to fit an Ed Brown 1911. 8)
Title: Re: SigSauer - What's Going On?
Post by: kjtrains on March 21, 2010, 12:51:13 PM: On that note, we can talk about it! ;D
Title: Re: SigSauer - What's Going On?
Post by: IOM on March 21, 2010, 08:43:33 PM: Not that I have anything against the Italians, but I'll stick with the greatest "American" Supercar to date ;D

(http://i794.photobucket.com/albums/yy229/doct_34/iphone2.jpg)
Title: Re: SigSauer - What's Going On?
Post by: tracker on March 21, 2010, 10:42:07 PM: I saw one of those in an inspection bay with all of the lids raised: very impressive.
Title: Re: SigSauer - What's Going On?
Post by: Dino on March 23, 2010, 01:46:38 PM: ItOnlyMoney, Thanks for the picture and gald you don't have anything against Italians as that Ford GT was designed by an Italian named Camilo Pardo who left Ford just last year after over 20 or so years of employment as a designer.

Being Italian myself one of my best friends who lived in Italy for a few years always told me, "if you put ONE Italian to work in a room by himself he will come out with a Mona Lisa or a Lamborghini, but if you put more than one in that same room, they would break out the wine and cheese and nothing would ever get done!" Life is good.
Title: Re: SigSauer - What's Going On?
Post by: tracker on March 23, 2010, 02:55:58 PM: Touche', Dino. Now, about those BMWs of yours......
Title: Re: SigSauer - What's Going On?
Post by: Dino on March 23, 2010, 03:24:22 PM: Tracker you must know it is very hard to find a car for sale made in Italy here in south west Virginia! F150 country.

Heck I have a hard time finding a good pizza!
Title: Re: SigSauer - What's Going On?
Post by: IOM on March 23, 2010, 04:16:42 PM: It appears as though my "Italians" comment may have been taken out of context. I was simply referring to the Italian makes (Ferrari, Lamborghini), not the Italian people. Having been to most of the Ford GT rallys, I've had the opportunity to meet Camilo Pardo. Great guy and designer. Now that Ford is turning things around and doing well, I hated to see someone of Camilo's talents leave. Camilo did a wonderful job of taking an already great design from the '60's and creating the new Ford GT.

By the way, Camilo was born in Manhattan, the first American of a Columbian family. That's not really that important to me, but it might be to you. I believe it's a little degrading to label Americans by their ethnic background. If you're born in this country, then you're an American. Just like the Rohrbaugh R9 is a great American made pistol, I value the fact that it's American made. I don't need to know the ethnic background of where the Rohrbaugh brothers came from, they're Americans to me.
Title: Re: SigSauer - What's Going On?
Post by: tracker on March 23, 2010, 04:31:26 PM: I didn't have even the remote feeling that any offense was intended or taken.
Title: Re: SigSauer - What's Going On?
Post by: Dino on March 23, 2010, 04:48:36 PM: Understand, nothing out of context just having fun. Really.

I am third generation, my gradfather fought in WW1 for the United States and was the most patriotic man I have ever known. We as a family are very proud to be American born Italians.

My partner told me Pardo was Italian as he met him when he was working for Ford of Europe in Italy. I guess he assumed he was Italian with a name like Pardo and working in Italy.

Our bad.
Title: Re: SigSauer - What's Going On?
Post by: IOM on March 23, 2010, 05:42:13 PM: I'm glad my post was not taken as offensive because that was definetly not my intent.

I think I've got this thread far enough off topic ;D

Sorry for any confusion. David

btw thanks to your grandfather for his service to the country.
Title: Re: SigSauer - What's Going On?
Post by: kjtrains on March 24, 2010, 01:34:18 AM: Excellent picture of the Ford GT. I like it and it's fast!
Title: Re: SigSauer - What's Going On?
Post by: Dino on March 24, 2010, 09:48:53 AM: ItsOnlyMoney, Thank you, and thanks for the picture of the GT!

Is that one yours?
Title: Re: SigSauer - What's Going On?
Post by: IOM on March 24, 2010, 10:29:13 AM: Yes, I got it back in 2006. That pic was taken a couple of years ago at the Hoover Dam.
Title: Re: SigSauer - What's Going On?
Post by: kjtrains on March 24, 2010, 10:53:46 AM: If anyone wants one like ItsOnlyMoney's, here's one available. Excellent with low miles, 2383, same 2006 model. Amazing car!

http://www.automobilemag.com/classifieds/14/2006/ford/gt/base/california/calabasas/230089229/113/images.html
Title: Re: SigSauer - What's Going On?
Post by: Dino on March 24, 2010, 11:15:52 AM: Great car!

One of my general managers has a long history with Ford and Ford Racing. He just traded his 1966 Shelby 289 and a few $$$ for a GT.

I asked him why and he told me he could not drive the Shelby without hurting the value but he had every intention of driving the GT!

I hope to see it soon now that the weather is gitting nice.
Title: Re: SigSauer - What's Going On?
Post by: kjtrains on March 24, 2010, 11:23:05 AM: You should ask him if you can take it for a drive; 0-60 in 3.3 sec. :) :)
Title: Re: SigSauer - What's Going On?
Post by: P7Enigma on March 24, 2010, 01:33:52 PM: Quote
If anyone wants one like ItsOnlyMoney's, here's one available. Excellent with low miles, 2383, same 2006 model. Amazing car!

http://www.automobilemag.com/classifieds/14/2006/ford/gt/base/california/calabasas/230089229/113/images.html

Wholly smokes!...230K!...I thought those things were in the 150K range...

Last time I was in the cockpit of one of those was at a IMSA event back in early '90s at Sebring.
Title: Re: SigSauer - What's Going On?
Post by: kjtrains on March 24, 2010, 02:46:28 PM: Yep! Value going up. Last one made was 9/21/06.
Title: Re: SigSauer - What's Going On?
Post by: whkrog on June 01, 2010, 05:54:10 PM: OK, a reply to an old post...
Although it shoots fine for a DAO pistol and I've never had any problems whatever with it, I am selling my SIG P250 compact, just because I need the money. (PS: I've also read and thought seriously about other posts on this forum, stating "I buy guns, I don't sell them"). But I also figure those posters are much more experienced than I am, and thus make better or more-appropriate-to-the-task choices.
So, I'll recover some money for the nice P250 and its accessories (a rail-mount Streamlight tactical flashlight and a LaserMax laser sight, 4 extra mags, Kydex holster, etc), and hopefully am putting the funds into good use:
an STI Trojan .45ACP '2011', to be modified by Bob Cogan of APW - a terrific guy and a great resource of information based on many years of working on multiple manufacturers and builders of pistols. Work to be done:
brushed chrome plating/finish, trigger action work, installation of fiber optic sights, fitting the gun to my hand measurements, full disassembly, polishing, cleaning, lubrication and sighting in, etc.
I wind up with a great 1911 .45, and a pistol that fully qualifies for IPSC, USPSA, IDPA, & SSSA.
(Plus I've always wanted a 1911-type pistol....)

AND I'll keep the SIG P226 Bob also 'did' for me (including porting) which is the sweetest 9mm pistol I've ever shot.
Except for the fact that on Memorial day I went to the range with my sister (she's 65) and brother-in-law and she out-shot me with my own pistol. 12 rounds within a 2 1/2" circle with the P226 from about 22 feet, two handed (she has arthritis and a wrist brace and can't shoot one-handed).
Damn.

PS; I'm "Bill' in addition to being 'whkrog'
Title: Re: SigSauer - What's Going On?
Post by: Richard S on June 01, 2010, 07:27:45 PM: Bill:

Every man needs at least one great 1911-type handgun in his lifetime. Good shooting! 8)

And come to think of it, this gives me another chance to post a photo of one of Bob Cogan's plating masterpieces done under subcontract from Clark's Custom Guns:

(http://i2.photobucket.com/albums/y30/RichardS/Feb2611.jpg)

And the end the BG sees with the LaserMax pulsing:

(http://i2.photobucket.com/albums/y30/RichardS/1911BusinessEndwithLaserMax.jpg)
Title: Re: SigSauer - What's Going On?
Post by: whkrog on June 01, 2010, 07:38:55 PM: Richard S:
I think you are exactly right.
Even though this is a Rohrbaugh forum (and I carry that guy every day) I will post a range report and some photos here on the new 1911, just for those who check this section.
--Bill
And PS again: I can't tell you how much a help (and a new friend) Bob Cogan has been, both with the Rohrbaugh, the SIG P226 and the with the STI 1911.
http://www.apwcogan.com/
And his office manager, Jason Selva, is terrific also.
Title: Re: SigSauer - What's Going On?
Post by: Richard S on June 01, 2010, 11:11:31 PM: Quote
Richard S:
I think you are exactly right.
Even though this is a Rohrbaugh forum (and I carry that guy every day) I will post a range report and some photos here on the new 1911, just for those who check this section.
--Bill
And PS again: I can't tell you how much a help (and a new friend) Bob Cogan has been, both with the Rohrbaugh, the SIG P226 and the with the STI 1911.
http://www.apwcogan.com/
And his office manager, Jason Selva, is terrific also.

HOOAH! 8)
Title: Re: SigSauer - What's Going On?
Post by: MJSeif on September 02, 2010, 01:20:50 AM: I had the same experience with the p250. For anyone looking -- they just aren't the same Sig Sauer that say, a 226 is. The modularity is cool (especially for the price sensitive), but the quality just isn't there. Don't get me wrong, it's fun to shoot, but it's just not what I expected from the brand. I kept waiting and waiting for the x-change & grip mod kits to come out and nothing happened. I must have talked to 3 reps in person and called 4 times, and kept getting the same diplomatic-speak answer. Just not the same robust weapon and just not the same hi-service level company I used to know. Disappointing. That said -- SWEET DAO trigger pull - butter smooth.
Title: Re: SigSauer - What's Going On?
Post by: whkrog on September 02, 2010, 12:57:34 PM: Yes, indeed. SIGUSA keeps sending me emails offerring me -- as a "new SIG purchaser" (13 months after the fact) various special marketing offers, and asking me to call my 'personal representative.' Four calls, four left messages over a period of about a month -- left both home/work and cell phone number. No return calls.
Serious bad wacko business problems here.
On the other hand the P226 that Bob Cogan plated, ported and did trigger work on for me, is the sweetest SIG 9mm you could imagine.
Title: KRe: SigSauer - What's Going On?
Post by: Reinz on September 02, 2010, 01:29:51 PM: But -

Keyword here is

GUNSMITH
Title: Re: SigSauer - What's Going On?
Post by: whkrog on September 02, 2010, 02:55:21 PM: Agree entirely. Find a great one. Let him do every gun you buy, and preferably ask him about the purchase ahead of time. If they've been in the business for more than 20 years, they know the ins-and-outs of more guns than you'd believe, and will offer invaluable advice, not just on the purchase but also on things you'll likely want to do the to firearm after-purchase.
Treat them well, like friends with an all-important common interest, pay them on time or up-front, be open to suggestions, and if there are any problems, call them and explain and give them the opportunity to do well by you.
And if you find such a one, spread the word. Very few people are overwhelmed with work these days, and everyone has families and bills to pay.
Title: Re: SigSauer - What's Going On?
Post by: Reinz on September 02, 2010, 03:14:55 PM: I agree with you as well, according to some of my freinds I have spent a small fortune supporting gunsmiths.

Guilty as charged!

I was not criticizing you for doing so, just one of our many gunmakers for their faults.
Title: Re: SigSauer - What's Going On?
Post by: whkrog on September 02, 2010, 03:28:49 PM: Reinz: oh, no offense taken. I did not even perceive it as a criticism, and even if so, that doesn't matter: criticism (as apposed to unreasoned abuse) is an integral and important part in everyone's development and should be welcomed.
PS: Glad to be back here on the forum, after kind of an absence (family health issues -- all stable now).
Best forum around, IMHO.
Title: Re: SigSauer - What's Going On?
Post by: Reinz on September 02, 2010, 03:49:13 PM: Wh - love your attitute! Glad your back, good health to you and yours.
Title: Re: SigSauer - What's Going On?
Post by: sslater on September 02, 2010, 07:47:40 PM: Too bad about the sad tales of the SIG P250. I was really hoping to pick one up after their new model teething problems were resolved.
The concept of a modular pistol family, allowing you to tailor slide length, butt length, etc., to your immediate requirements appeals to this retired mechanical engineer...
My P239 (.40 S&W) has been a gem. Zero issues.

It seems that Sig and Ruger are going down the same road. I haven't read any "street" reports on the new S&W "Bodyguard' series of revolvers and pistols, and I hope S&W isn't following the Ruger pattern of having the shooting public do their production validation (recalls on the SR9, LCR and LCP).
Title: Re: SigSauer - What's Going On?
Post by: whkrog on September 02, 2010, 08:29:19 PM: OK, Just received another sales/marketing email today from SIG:, offering a 'Labor Day Holiday discount' on their Custom Shop services. Here's what I replied:
"Yes, well after my previous one experience with your 'custom shop' who returned to me a dangerous, non-functioning P226, I've chosen to actually use a 30+ year experienced gunsmith to do all and any work on my SIGS. BTW, thanks for obsoleting and making worthless my previously-purchased SIG P250, which is no big deal, since it appears to be of dubious quality anyway. It would be nice however, if you would stop sending me silly marketing advertisements ("Thank you for being a new SIG purchaser") 13 months after the purchase, and then giving me a person and number to call, with which I've left four messages, and never get a call back, ever. Also, your customer AND dealer lines are notorious for never being answered, and thus placing people on hold for excessive times (like, hours...)
So, your company has a great deal of problems, and don't think the community of SIG users don't know it."

OK, I was a little cranky at the time....
But all that was mentioned is true, and I would certainly BUY a SIGSAUER firearm from them (other than a P250 handgun), I would never trust them for any after-sale services or support, ever. All you get is Marketing Dept. crap and Corpspeak. And they tried to kill me with their mod on my P226 (didn't work DA at all, SA had trigger pull less than 2 lbs ' not really measurable) and yet they signed off on it as 'tested and certified'.
Never again.
Title: Re: SigSauer - What's Going On?
Post by: Richard S on September 03, 2010, 08:11:41 AM: Bill:

I suspect that if more customers would respond to manufacturer solicitations such as you did, the quality of products produced would improve. The capitalistic marketplace works when consumers become actively involved.

And revisiting this thread gave me a chance to marvel again at that SIG P226 Bob Cogan of AP&W customized for you. What a beauty!
Title: Re: SigSauer - What's Going On?
Post by: kjtrains on September 05, 2010, 10:48:37 AM: Bill. I did go back and look at your Custom Sig P226 and must say that it did truly bring out the drool squad yet once again.
Title: Re: SigSauer - What's Going On?
Post by: yankee2500 on September 05, 2010, 11:15:01 AM: A good end to a bad experience, very nice looking Sig for sure.

John