AMMO TEST #3 ...... results available at last!!

[R9SCarry]

OK guys .. many apolagies for the wait .... particularly to Dan who I know was thirsting for results from the Rangers he sent me.  I did tho need to run some things by Eric and Karl before ''going live'' with the URL ... and seeing as those guys work all hours, it took a while.!!

Anyways - had a chat with both today and after an addition on my conclusions page .. was ready to go.  That is all uploaded as is the updated R9 ammo data page, so ... do go peek when you have time.

[size=18]R9 ammo test #3[/size][/url]

[size=18]R9 ammo data page[/size][/url]

All comments and queries welcome.  I will say again that for expansion tests I must try something better than wet pack.  Water would be preferable if I had the necessary large tank - and even better would be gel .. but cost and logistical problems there.

[rtw]

Very nice job. Much thanks.

[bigdave]

I think you did a wonderful job with your testing and it is very helpful in determining appropriate carry ammo for the R9.

Thanks!!

[Incursion]

I think the destabilization is a little disconcerting given that this pistol cost $950.

[R9SCarry]

Superficially I would once have agreed about the destabilization .. but having learned the reason for the freebore being generous and why - and adding in close range useage factors ... I think it is something I can accept - personally.  

As far as cost goes ... the gun is a hibrid high tolerance piece IMO which has had to have design concessions made in order to achieve the goal of such a small piece in a major cal .... I doubt it could be any other way .. plus remember too .. the choice of ammo not only aids the reliability factor but also all but rules out frequent or significant bullet instability probs.

I can live with that myself .. but appreciate not everyone agrees.

Again .. only my own 2c!

[DDGator]

Fantastic job, Chris.  Really spectacular.  Thank you so much.


As for Incursion's comment:  All critisims of this gun seem to come down to price... I have heard it all.  "Oh yeah, well a cost that costs $1,000 should have X or shouldn't have X!" This is a high quality gun produced with expensive materials (no plastic, no cast or MIM parts -- instead stainless steel, aircraft aluminum, carbon fiber and Wolff springs) in a low volume factory with a lot of hand fitting.

Furthermore, there was ton of R&D that went into this gun.  I can't recall if we have discussed this before, but Karl and Eric spent a lot of time and money working with Wolff and others to design the shortest possible slide/spring combination to permit reliable function.  Much was trial and error, until they found the smallest combination that would contain 9mm pressures and function properly.  The freebore issue is, I am sure, related to that.  This is a design which absolutely pushes the envelope of gun design and the laws of physics!  The reason its not .25 inches shorter is because its not possible -- can't reasonably be done.

Accept the R-9 for what it is.  A sports car.  A thoroughbred.  A semi-custom handgun that pushes the limits of what is possible in a 9mm pocketgun.

Its not a target pistol, a race gun, a compact or even a sub-compact.  It can only do what it can do.  R9SCarry's results--I think--prove that it can do a lot.  If bullet stability is your ultimate goal, a Glock 19 should do well for you.  Or better yet, a Glock 34.  Just don't expect them to fit in your pocket.

[jimacp]

Dang Chris......nice photos and layout as usual. Do you work for a magazine or have graphics or photography background?  

[R9SCarry]

Thx Duane.

I would mention one more thing .. and this is relevant to something I discussed with Karl.  He told me how with his Seecamp - bought in 1980 ... he might put a coupla mags of ammo thru every - what .. 3 months.  Clean up and put it back in his attache case, or wherever it lived.  This meant he ''proved'' it .. he also swapped mags ... relaxing one and refilling the other.

I have come to think we should treat the R9 similarly.  Sure ... initially we break a new gun in .. we need to practice and explore the boundaries of functionality ... be proficient.  IMO this can be done over the first 100 rounds.  If then we make a wise choice on carry ammo ... and periodically check for cleanliness and function .. then I think we need to let this pup become what it is meant to be.  A close quarters, emminently concealable, pocket 9mm.  NOT a regular range plinker!  Would we take our Ferrari onto rough roads willingly, and beat it up?

Having put over 300 rounds now thru my first R9 ... I am actually loathe to do much more, despite having a new recoil spring ass'y.  About all I would like to do now is swap the pin for the correct spec uprated version.

When I get #2 .. over next month I rather hope .. this will become the constant-use carry .. whether BUG or primary . I shall not worry so much about aesthetic degredation ... then I can keep my #1 for posterity .. well, loaded and ready buy the desk here maybe!

[R9SCarry]

[size=13] Do you work for a magazine or have graphics or photography background?[/size]

Haha ... you posted while i was writing Jim!

No - no magazine work but - most of my work is web design oriented (generally very ''gizzmo-free - don't use many bells and whistles!) .. plus data conversion and that sorta stuff.  Despite my primary qual' being Engineering (systems) ... I started freelance photography long ago - as an extension of a hobby.  I had my own darkroom for years and processed all film and prints ... mostly B/W work.

I guess that helps even now with dig work . Camera useage etc is not something you forget .. plus all the image manip work I have to do with web things means I can tweak pics usually, enough to make em do what I want!

So - expert?  No, not really ...... but enough experience I guess to sorta mostly know what I am doing!  (some of the time )

[DDGator]

I agree with Chris.  I have shot a couple hundred rounds to verify function, test my carry ammo (Gold Dots), and get comfortable with the gun.  Having done that, I plan to shoot it occasionally (at least quarterly) -- probably just the 13 rounds I carry in the gun and spare mag.  That does three things: 1) verifies continuing function, 2) keeps me familiar with the gun, and 3) rotates my carry ammo.  I will clean after each session, but that is pretty much my standard procedure with all my guns.

[Incursion]

I can accept the tradeoffs if I can get the gun to work reliably in my hands.  I think Eric is starting to see me as a thorn in his side.  His tone when I told him about the broken barrel pin wasn't what I expected.

[jimacp]

I spoke with Eric last week about this same topic. I have over 600 totally bobble free rounds through mine. Changed to new pin and grip screws. Tested new pin with 12 more rounds...now my plinking days with R9s are over...now it is my carry gun but will only be test fired periodically...carry 124 gr gold dots.

[jimacp]

Incursion....sorry you continue to have problems..I would send gun back again.....I cant imagine Eric won't or can't fix it.....I only know I have not had ANY misfire, bobbles, fte, or anything but bang in over 600 rounds of gold dot and pmc.

[Incursion]

Yeah, if I had 600 rounds through mine without any hiccups, I'd be carrying it too!  I envy you!

[R9SCarry]

Incursion ... I really am distressed you have had problems ... seems very much a rarity.  I trust tho in the long run all can be sorted out for you.  Murphy always seems to get into the frame at times!

One small point re the test stuff .. I have been told of and found one or two links which were wrong .. happens!!  I think I have sorted this now but do please tell me if something dson't go where it should!

And .. off topic ... but sure as heck hope we'll hear from fly soon.