Anyone ever have to use their R9 for self defense?

[JR956678]

The consensus was to stop the threat, whatever it takes. A predetermined decision to fire when drawing a weapon may not be the wisest choice if the attacker does a 180.

Very true. Of course if a would-be attacker does a 180 then the threat has been stopped; they also would not be laughing as they would have taken the sight of a 9mm muzzle very seriously.

[chameleon]

This is my take on all this. Now mind you I am not answering your question directly and I also talked about this on another forum.

I use my Seecamp or my R-Nine daily, I carry either both or at least one at a time, but never without.
Every day there is potential of you needing to use that pistol.
There are scenarios that I'm sure we can fill this thread up with.
How many times do you do something to piss someone off, I did not that long ago by merely changing lanes and not seeing that wonderful person already occupying that certain part of real estate. He honked, well he really laid on the horn, and it didn't end there, he wanted me to see he was mad and just didn't let up, he now is doing far worse driving that I initiated by an unhealthy lane change. He came along side of me, he yelled and I thanked him for not letting me make car contact with him by honking his horn, and I waved and I smiled.
You see, I used my CCW to diffuse the situation, I knew I had an advantage over him, and I was wrong right up until he came after me.
So that is one example how I used my CCW to save my butt.

[tracker]

An iron fist in a velvet glove is a good perspective on an encounter situation but how do you know for certain he didn't have a bigger CCW?

[chameleon]

An iron fist in a velvet glove is a good perspective on an encounter situation but how do you know for certain he didn't have a bigger CCW?

He was mad, real mad, you see you and I can't get that mad, can't afford to. We have to maintain coolness in any situation.
If he were like me, he would have honked to let me know he was there and I would have waved and case settled, then I would have thought maybe he was armed because a little thing like that didn't bother him.He kept his cool. I could have easily called 911 on the cell, said there is a lunatic wanting to kill me on the highway with his car, he won't back off and I'm afraid he may have a GUN! What if he did have a gun, he'd be arrested for sure, because I felt threatened.
We have to stay cool.

[the_skunk]

  These clowns muttered a few expletives which impugned my ancestral heritage,  

Who is your ancestor?

[Paindoctor]

Richard described the encounter very well, indeed. There is nothing quite like an eloquent voice of experience. This subject came up recently in a CHL class. I asked a question about drawing but not firing on an imminent threat situation. The consensus was to stop the threat, whatever it takes. A predetermined decision to fire when drawing a weapon may not be the wisest choice if the attacker does a 180. The class instructor asked us what course of action we should take if the "perp" cuts and runs--the answer was to call 911, the practical reason being the attacker may also call to report the incident. Depending on the situation, calling 911 may not be necessary.  

Thanks very much for the solid advice, Tracker. I agree, despite what a lot of people say. If someone turns and runs the other way, because you were armed, serious, and ready, then shooting them in the back will probably get you serious jail time, not to mention a huge legal bill, and the scare of your life when it goes before a jury. So even if you're found innocent - you are out of pocket many thousands in legal defense. I agree completely with the 911 call, however you need to be clear that you felt your life was in imminent danger, hence the gun came out, because merely pointing and threatening someone with a gun is a mandatory 3 years in Florida, unless it's justified. Another point to consider: Let's say, you shoot someone and it is justified. You may still incur the wrath (and expense) of a huge civil case brought by the "victim's" family, even if you're found innocent in a justifiable homicide situation. My bottom line here is this: Merely by carrying a gun, and taking it out (even if justified) exposes you to potential risks, such as jail, counter-attack, potential lawsuits, BUT, and here is the crucial BUT - if you are really in a situation where someone is literally threatening you or your loved one's life - you will so glad people like Karl Rohrbaugh exist. I do agree with someone else's motto: "It is better to be judged by 12, then carried by 6".

[TBI]

I'd rather walk away, drive away or talk my way out of any situation.  If I pull a gun, ( my R9S which goes with me where ever I go) I'll use it. End of story. Then everything changes.

[tracker]

This is excellent food for thought and thanks to Richard for sharing his experience. Below are some comments on an urban road rage incident. The lawyer who defended himself was no billed. I think most concealed carry holders would not have any problem knowing when to shoot and when to walk away, especially members of this forum.


http://www.fark.com/comments/246826/Road-rage-guy-punches-through-car-window-of-armed-Texas-lawyer-Guess-whos-dead-who-got-off?startid=1668169

[Carter]

I'd rather walk away, drive away or talk my way out of any situation.  If I pull a gun, ( my R9S which goes with me where ever I go) I'll use it. End of story. Then everything changes.

That's a very profound point to make because each situation and each person is going to have a personally declared point of no return.
We all want to believe that we will make the most bestest decision for what that point is, but the reality is that under a state of rising duress and stress, most of us will either pull a weapon prematurely (as judged retrospectively) or too late (also as judged retrospectively, sometimes by your survivors).

The responsibility of carrying for defense is deep and far reaching, and all we can hope for is that whatever situation confronts us will be "clear", "evident", and "obvious".
The problem is that I'll bet that some confusion and doubt is often brought into the situation (by the potential perp), so everything comes down to our personal judgement, and I have met too many people who's judgement may be clouded during difficult times.

[the_skunk]

 

because merely pointing and threatening someone with a gun is a mandatory 3 years in Florida, unless it's justified.

Then you need to depend about the cop's ability, and whose side he will take.  South Fl is very cultural conscious  .... pull a gun on Abraham and it's jail, but pull a gun on Jose and you get scolded. Pull a gun on Leroy Brown and leroy gets arrested

[tracker]

That would be southeast Florida, I think. It might be a different protocol in Ft. Myers.

[Reinz]

Carter has really made a good point, once you pull your gun, you have "declared a point of no return".

So true, especially in this age of cell phones, cameras and videos.

[Carter]

Carter has really made a good point, once you pull your gun, you have "declared a point of no return".

So true, especially in this age of cell phones, cameras and videos.

That's pretty much it, but I was mostly getting at the idea that each of us may have a different "point of no return".

(I know, scenarios get silly), but imagine yourself at a gas station in a rough part of town at night and a guy is walking toward you speaking unintelligably and carrying a satchel with his hand in it.
Without breaking it down any further, I can imagine this exact situation ending up with one concealed carry person pulling a weapon, while another concealed carry person might decide to just talk to the guy to see if he's just selling CD's (or whatever) and tell him to buzz off.

This is the "unclear" situation that I could imagine 20 different people acting in 20 different ways, all the way to ignoring the guy who turns out to be a predator and getting killed and robbed yourself, to shooting a guy who is just selling CD's... and everything in between.

Just an interesting and provocative kind of thing to think about...

[tracker]

The scenario you describe is exactly why I don't buy gas at conventional stations when possible. A filling station is one of the most vulnerable locations and not just in rough parts of town; I can remember many occasions when I have been approached by shady characters while filling my tank.

[kjtrains]

I am definitely always looking around as to who's around and alert to anyone approaching.  Hand is on the firearm; so far, no scary situations.