The Rohrbaugh Forum

Rohrbaugh Products and Accessories => Rohrbaugh R9 (all variations) => Topic started by: Bubbaman on November 25, 2005, 02:37:18 PM

Title: Still Considering.....
Post by: Bubbaman on November 25, 2005, 02:37:18 PM: I've been quietly observing the forum for a while now. The whole R-9 platform seems wonderful, especialy when you consider that the Kel-Tec P3AT is only .380. But........ I'm amazed at the number of posts, discussions, etc. concerning failures to feed, and the many other issues. The Rohrbaugh web site almost leads you to believe that these little pistols are "custom" guns. How long has the R-9 / R-9s been on the market now? I recently read a post by the forum founder (sorry - can't remember your name) about all the other manufacturers having problems, too. There is one HUGE difference, though. Rohrbaugh only makes ONE pistol! I'm not bashing here, I've actually been considering purchasing an R-9s. Will someone please tell me why I should pay $900-$1000 for a Rohrbaugh? I'd like to see some good news for a change. :o
Title: Re: Still Considering.....
Post by: R9SCarry on November 25, 2005, 03:50:52 PM: Welcome Bubbaman :)

Well yes - we have had numerous discussions re some problems - and I guess superficially at least it might seem like the pup is plagued with trouble. However, the ratio of problems to no problems is heavily in favor of no problems!! It's like news - bad news is invariably more apparent than good.!

My first R9 was received about May 2004 and so I guess we can say that close to two years is coming up, for the pistol to have been selling openly.

I don't actually IMO feel that the manufacturer ''only'' making one pistol has a lot of relevence when it comes to any problems - it is more I think a ''model'' thing - and so other manufacturers who make more than one can still have problems with their more diminutive offerings. Consider too - some of the 1911 ''loaded'' guns - and how often people pay $1500 and more, only to have initial problems - this is not confined to just small guns - tho I think as far as the smaller guns go, the more likelehood there could be for hiccups - due to even more demanding criteria.

As far as paying the high cost - well - that is down for most of us I think to wanting what is really about the ultimate in pocket pistols, that offers a 9mm caliber. The development/ gestation period for this gun was necessarily long - the tolerancing is tight and most of the gun is made in house, with great attention to hand assembly and QC. This all makes for inevitable high costs - in fact I reckon the payback time on overall investment will be long in coming.

I think any individual will have to weigh the pro's and con's for themselves - and here is about the best place to check it out - but, trying to read thru not just the posts about problems - try and get the overall picture.
Title: Re: Still Considering.....
Post by: tracker on November 25, 2005, 04:17:50 PM: There is another factor here and that is that bad news
travels faster and with more gravity than good news. I
am sure that a lot of us who have experienced flawless
functioning have just said nothing.
Title: Re: Still Considering.....
Post by: Bubbaman on November 25, 2005, 04:56:20 PM: Thanks for the responses guys. I have a question. What is recoil like with say 124 grain Gold Dots? And I agree that 9mm will certainly be nice to have as a true "pocket pistol". Also, what is the trigger like on the Rohrbaugh? The P3AT is pretty good for a "cheap" pistol, and the trigger on the PM9 is good, too. Where does the R-9 fall in the smoothness and weight categories? Seems like someone said it was like butter......... I like butter. :)
Title: Re: Still Considering.....
Post by: R9SCarry on November 25, 2005, 05:28:38 PM: Trigger - 7# almost exactly - and indeed yes - butter!! Creep is not in the gun's vocabulary! I'd go so far as to say - it is probably the sweetest DA only trigger out there.

My son tried mine for first time a week ago and was amazed at the trigger. The mechanism too is IMO unique - those who have had right grip panel off to see it will know what I mean.

Here is one pic from a set on my FAQ site to show this a bit -

(http://www.acbsystems.com/boards/rohrbaugh/images/r9-dis-251-s.jpg)

Recoil is not too different for me between 115, 124 or even 147 come to that. It is brisk and snappy - but to be expected from such a small platform - and it is essential to have a very firm and controlled grip - not a gun for whimpy hold! Practice on this makes perfect for most.
Title: Re: Still Considering.....
Post by: Bubbaman on November 25, 2005, 05:34:46 PM: R9SCarry -

How about recoil compared to the Kel-Tec P3AT? It's only .380 but it's lighter.
Title: Re: Still Considering.....
Post by: R9SCarry on November 25, 2005, 05:40:58 PM: When I had my P3-AT I found that decidedly less comfortable to shoot than R9 - tho I will say again - the R9 is not actually 'comfortable' of course. ;). Let's just use the euphemism - a tad ''agressive'' LOL.

The .380 is quite a snappy round and certainly in the P3 was for me less desirable than the R9 with 9mm. The .380 is much nicer thru my (my wife's now!) Bersa Thunder.

Maybe some folks here with Mustangs, NAA GUardians etc can comment on those too compared with R9 and recoil.
Title: Re: Still Considering.....
Post by: Bubbaman on November 25, 2005, 05:57:50 PM: Hmmmmm..... I should have asked you about the difference in the R-9 recoil and the PM9. I just sold a PM9 and know it well. The PM9 and R-9 are only 2 or 3 ounces different. Ever shot a PM9?
Title: Re: Still Considering.....
Post by: R9SCarry on November 25, 2005, 06:03:37 PM: I think I tried a PM9 just once but really have a job remembering it well.

Best I can think is - there was just a shade more gun to get hold of - and so a measure easier to control. There are folks here with PM9's tho and so they can better answer that.
Title: Re: Still Considering.....
Post by: Bubbaman on November 25, 2005, 06:10:47 PM: Thanks again. I think I saw where someone recently received a new shipment of R9s in. I may get with him. I'm also an FFL dealer. ;)
Title: Re: Still Considering.....
Post by: Richard S on November 25, 2005, 06:17:11 PM: Bubbaman:

Welcome to the Forum.

I own both the Guardian .380 and the R9. Bearing in mind that felt recoil is highly subjective, I find my G380's recoil, even with +P ammunition, to be a little less than that of my R9. I would describe the R9's recoil as "stout" but entirely manageable.

As to the cost of the R9, the best simply costs more -- more to manufacture and more to purchase. I have one of the first R9s sold to the public and am pleased to report that it has shown no vices.
Title: Re: Still Considering.....
Post by: Bubbaman on November 25, 2005, 06:33:16 PM: I had a Guardian in .32 but I hated the trigger. I guess there are folks who do trigger jobs on them...... I like the P32 better than the P-3AT. I think it just works better in that platform. I'd sure like to check out an R-9.
Title: Re: Still Considering.....
Post by: Fud on November 25, 2005, 06:53:20 PM: The Guardian has a repeat striker capability; the P32 and the P-3AT don't.
Title: Re: Still Considering.....
Post by: MountainMan on November 25, 2005, 07:51:37 PM: Welcome Bubbaman.

As already been stated here there has been much discussion with some R9 problems but they are a minority. For the owners though that is little comfort. The big difference is the great customer support from Rohrbaugh. I had a new Colt that jammed on anything but ball ammo. Sent it back. Got it back four months later - still only functioned well on ball. Hard to get anyone to talk to you at Colt. Not so with Rohrbaugh if there is a need.

As to spending $1000 - depends on the person. If that much would cause you financial problems go for something else. You can pay that much for a custom pocket knife. Because I like quality I bought a R9, and the R9 is one of a kind. In fact just got my second R9 - traded a pocket knife for it. There is a thread on that under "General Discussion".

You are welcomed to jump aboard.
Daved
Title: Re: Still Considering.....
Post by: Bubbaman on November 25, 2005, 11:08:37 PM: Thanks Dave. I understand quality, and after years of work and the blessing of the Lord, money isn't as hard to come by now. But I'm careful / cautious where that money goes, at least most of the time. :D
Title: Re: Still Considering.....
Post by: Brenden on November 26, 2005, 08:27:25 PM: Bubbaman...

Welcome... :)

I bought sight unseen the first time..

I liked what I saw enough to buy again.. ;)

And again... :o

If anything happens with the pup-service is outstanding..I have not had to use it yet,but one of the owners called me to answer a couple of questions I had!! ;D 8)

I do recognize quality,and this gun drips of it!! 8)

Your decision to buy,but I think you will be more than satisfied with the pup.. ;)

Brenden
Title: Re: Still Considering.....
Post by: DDGator on November 27, 2005, 12:01:56 AM: Bubba,

The elusive founder you describe is me... ;) I see you already read my post about the "internet" effect, so I won't repeat it.

There is plenty of good news here if you look -- far, far more than bad news. And -- as we have said -- the good news is reported far less often.

The R-9 is nearly a custom piece. How many other guns are made with no MIM, stamped or forged parts? No plastic. Wolff springs. Top notch quality at every spec.

There are plenty of very satisfied customers here. I don't think you will find your money poorly spent. And, if for any reason you do, the market will continue to be strong to re-sell these guns for quite some time.

Welcome to the forum. ;D
Title: Re: Still Considering.....
Post by: theirishguard on November 27, 2005, 04:40:28 PM: Every time I do a gun show, some of my Rohrbaugh customers come by and tell me how happy they are with the pup.
It is like this forum, old friends stopping by and visiting.
Tom
Title: Re: Still Considering.....
Post by: Bubbaman on November 27, 2005, 04:42:29 PM: Hey Tom - How much is an R-9s? Email me at bubbasguns@adelphia.net. Thanks.
Title: Re: Still Considering.....
Post by: Michigunner on November 27, 2005, 04:53:29 PM: Bubbaman,

I bought my R9S without ever seeing one.

It is a wonderful pistol and mine has been flawless, even though a few owners have had problems. Fortunately, Rohrbaugh has guaranteed the pistol for the lifetime of the owner.

Mine kicks like a mule, caused by the little dickens squirming in my hand. That was solved by putting some abrasive tape on the front and back of the grip.

I'm sure you will be a happy owner. It is fun to see and touch an article of such quality. The R9S is small and powerful, and stays unnoticed in your pocket.

Bill
Title: Re: Still Considering.....
Post by: theirishguard on November 27, 2005, 05:15:02 PM: Bubbaman, PM sent Tom
Title: Re: Still Considering.....
Post by: DTM_39 on November 28, 2005, 03:23:41 PM: Bubbaman , Welcome The R-9 is a work of Art. When you hold one for a little while you will understand what all the fuss is about. When you shoot one you will order one.
Title: Re: Still Considering.....
Post by: Newt on November 28, 2005, 08:44:02 PM: DMT_39 is right! Hold it ,examine it, shoot it, and you will own it, or most likely, like alot of us you will own two! ::)
Title: Re: Still Considering.....
Post by: CaptBW on November 29, 2005, 08:42:40 AM: First I heard the scuttlebutt about a new, small, 9mm. Then I saw photos in magazines. Then I found this forum.

The R that I own is the only one I have seen or held. I couldn't be happier with the weapon. It is a jewel.
Title: Re: Still Considering.....
Post by: theirishguard on November 29, 2005, 10:13:29 AM: Bubbaman, take the plunge, you will never look back!! PM me if you want one.
Tom
Title: Re: Still Considering.....
Post by: Bubbaman on November 30, 2005, 11:07:20 PM: I appreciate all the "encouragement", but I'm still thinking on this. Does anyone have pics of the R right beside, or maybe even on top of a P-3AT? Thanks ;)
Title: Re: Still Considering.....
Post by: R9SCarry on December 01, 2005, 12:00:56 AM: Bubbaman - haven't gone to check but IIRC there is one pic at least on my FAQ dealing with P3 and R9 - not one over other but at least some sorta comparison.
Title: Re: Still Considering.....
Post by: Bubbaman on December 01, 2005, 01:15:04 AM: Hey R9SCarry - how do the two pistols compare, as far as concealability goes?
Title: Re: Still Considering.....
Post by: CaptBW on December 01, 2005, 07:15:31 AM: I sold my P-3AT and bought a Rohrbaugh. There is no comparison.
Title: Re: Still Considering.....
Post by: Michigunner on December 01, 2005, 10:59:38 AM: Bubbaman,

Before purchasing the R9S, I was concerned that it might not carry as well as my P3AT.

The P3AT seemed smaller and lighter, but when it got right down to carrying them, there was not enough difference to matter, in my opinion. The R9S is also small and light, quite like the P3AT.

I use the Milt Sparks PCH holster and it adapts perfectly to the curve of the leg. The R9S is ideally suited for pocket carry.

I made the transition without any problems, except that abrasive tape was required on the front and back of the handle so it would not squirm during firing. Certainly that's just one individual's problem, but tape was required to prevent the pain of recoil.

Please remember that we all purchased the P3AT with the expectation that it might have to be returned to the factory to get it working. That was a fact of life. As far as I know, the majority of R9S pistols work fine. Mine has never failed.

Another candidate, the Kahr PM9, was entirely too heavy for me to enjoy pocket carry.

For what it's worth, many people seem to think the pocket pistol market is saturated.

Not me! I long to see a tiny Glock and tiny Sig, both no larger than the Rohrbaugh. Because there are now "shall issue" laws, with growing numbers of CPL holders, perhaps it will happen. I hope so.

Meanwhile, we have the wonderful R9S.

Bill
Title: Re: Still Considering.....
Post by: Bubbaman on December 01, 2005, 11:44:32 AM: After looking at the R9 specs I can see that the dimensions are extremely close to the P-3AT. How about recoil? Is the R9 less punishing? My big concern right now is the cracked slides. I understand that customer service is wonderful. However.... what is the underlying problem? Is it a materials issue, a production issue, or worse - a design issue?

Quote
Please remember that we all purchased the P3AT with the expectation that it might have to be returned to the factory to get it working.

I haven't had to send back a Kel-Tec. But my point is this. Kel-Tecs are $250.00 pistols. You can afford to tinker with them alot for the difference in the R9 price tag. You shouldn't have to send back a $950.00 pistol. Also, Kel-Tec has been great about fixing their issues - just like Rohrbaugh. So, is part of the decision to purchase an R based on the semi-custom name that it has? Or the price that you pay? I've lurked around for a while now and don't seem to see any more problems with the Kel-Tec than I do with the Rohrbaugh. :-/
Title: Re: Still Considering.....
Post by: tracker on December 01, 2005, 12:23:26 PM: If price versus reliability were the issue
people would only buy chevys, fords, etc.,
instead of porsches and ferraris; and they would
only buy timex's instead of rolexes anf patek phillipes.

I bought a Springfield Mil-Spec and let Teddy Jacobson
make it a magnificent piece but do I love it more than
my two series 70 Gold Cups? probably not.
Title: Re: Still Considering.....
Post by: Bubbaman on December 01, 2005, 12:40:16 PM: :D All my Fords have been as reliable as a Porsche or Ferrari. Timex does what Rolex does for .005 of the price!
Title: Re: Still Considering.....
Post by: Michigunner on December 01, 2005, 12:52:57 PM: Bubbaman,

I guess it just depends on whether you want one, or not. It probably would not be worth the extra money for you, when you already have an excellent solution.

I never had any problem with my P3AT. If your Kel-Tec is totally reliable, it makes a terrific carry piece.

Many of us here receive great enjoyment from the obvious quality of the R9S. I like to look at it, and hold it.

Meanwhile, that P3AT gets the job done.

Bill
Title: Re: Still Considering.....
Post by: R9SCarry on December 01, 2005, 12:59:20 PM: Quote
[size=13]Hey R9SCarry - how do the two pistols compare, as far as concealability goes?[/size]

Bubbaman - I do think the P3 has an ''edge'' for carry - solely because it is a fraction lighter and is maybe less likely to show if in no holster - but the difference is not much. After that tho it's apples and oranges IMO!

Re cracked slides - I'd all but ignore that - it's a temporary glitch which is being put right when needed and due to a small batch of billets which were metalurgically imperfect it seems now.

As for recoil - I'd say that the P3 is, or was, for me a less pleasant experience! Let's say too perhaps - .380 in P3 is similar to 9mm in R9. Both pretty ''snappy'' ;)

BTW - having now found some grip tape - have applied this to my carry R9 and the difference in feel is quite profound.
Title: Re: Still Considering.....
Post by: Michigunner on December 01, 2005, 01:05:18 PM: Chris,

I'm delighted to hear that the grip tape makes a profound difference for you.

At the risk of beating this subject to death, I could not have continued using my R9S, except Steve mailed me some of his tape. Now, all is well.

For anyone interested, you don't have to wrap it around the grip. A little bit on the front and back is sufficient.

Bill
Title: Re: Still Considering.....
Post by: tracker on December 01, 2005, 01:50:24 PM: Bubbaman,
I would advise you to save your money and stay
with the Keltec.
Title: Re: Still Considering.....
Post by: Michigunner on December 01, 2005, 03:17:41 PM: I also think Bubbaman will be happier if he stays with the Kel-Tec.
Title: Re: Still Considering.....
Post by: R9SCarry on December 01, 2005, 03:27:21 PM: Bill - so I don't go off topic on this thread - I'll post a coupla pics soon of my own grip-tape useage. That'll help folks compare with what they have done or others might plan to do.
Title: Re: Still Considering.....
Post by: Michigunner on December 01, 2005, 03:49:36 PM: Thanks, Chris.

I am very interested in seeing it.

Bill
Title: Re: Still Considering.....
Post by: DDGator on December 01, 2005, 03:57:26 PM: Bubbaman,

You can't compare the number of "issues" with firearms by the number of posts on a forum. I don't think anyone yet knows what the slide cracks are relating to, but I trust it will all be resolved.

For bang for the buck, Kel-Tecs are great guns. It is hard though to compare what you get with a KT to what you get with a Rohrbaugh. I don't think it is "name" so much as it is top notch quality. There are also those who want a true pocket sized pistol in 9mm, not .380 ACP.

If price is a big concern, I wouldn't try to talk you into a Rohrbaugh. I hope you don't take that the wrong way -- its not meant to be snobby -- just the truth. You may be the kind who will spend $5,000 on a watch, but don't want to spend $950 on a gun. Its not necessarily a "wealth" issue -- its a preference. Honestly, most if not all of us could afford to spend $1,000 on a gun to protect our lives and our families -- but you don't have to spend that much.

If the R-9 floats your boat -- great. Join the party. If not, the Kel-Tecs will serve you well.
Title: Re: Still Considering.....
Post by: Bubbaman on December 01, 2005, 07:33:03 PM: You know.... you guys are great. I appreciate honesty. Money isn't the issue. It's whether it's worth the money for what you get. I have a Nighthawk Customs Talon II, a $2,200.00 pistol, that I absolutely love.
(http://img355.imageshack.us/img355/989/img4388medium5rh.jpg)
But you see, I have never heard ONE bad thing about a Nighthawk. My experience with them is exceptional. So, with them, it's worth it for me because I do feel that it is a work of art. Now, the R9 and R9-s..... I love what I've seen of them. From what I've heard, customer service is top notch with them also. It all boils down to reliabilty, dependability, function, etc. I have a P-3AT that I carry, mostly when it's warm enough for no jacket. Maybe by the time the Spring rolls around I'll feel confident enough with Rohrbaugh to buy an R9-s. For the cool weather, since I wear a coat alot while checking work (I'm a commercial drywall and acoustical ceiling contractor, as well as an FFL dealer), I'm carrying my Springfield Micro Compact .40. It's at Fireblade Systems getting a little spruced up. I know that 9mm is better than 380 for pocket carry, but I'll have to justify the extra $700.00 first. :o Thanks guys, your imput is greatly appreciated. I'd still like to see pics of an R, on or next to a P-3AT.
Title: Re: Still Considering.....
Post by: R9SCarry on December 01, 2005, 10:32:32 PM: Bubbaman - you have not been to my FAQ site then - tsk, tsk!!!

Let me find a link to the page where that pic exists - not one over other but still a pic showing both. The page of several comparisons referred to is HERE (http://www.acbsystems.com/boards/rohrbaugh/basefile/compared2.htm)

For this post tho - here is a pic with a P32 followed by the P3AT one.

(http://www.acbsystems.com/boards/rohrbaugh/images/compared/p32-s.jpg)

(http://www.acbsystems.com/boards/rohrbaugh/images/compared/p3at-334.jpg)
Title: Re: Still Considering.....
Post by: ken on December 04, 2005, 11:15:26 AM: Simply put there is NO comparison of the Kel-Tec guns and the Rohrbaugh. The quality is light years apart and the R9 is I think really not expensive for what you get. No problems with mine. For info purposes the PM9 and R9S are very similar in felt recoil. You have to hold on to both to function well. In 40 years of shooting, reloading and fooling around with guns and hunting, I have had fail to fire quit a few times, in ALL kinds of firearms and calibers. Many of those times a second hit with the firing pin would let off the round. Here is where I fill the R9 has a great advantage with a hammer instead of a striker. All you have to do is keep pulling the trigger to keep hitting the primer. With the other method of course you only have one chance before you have to work the slide. All the other features are great on the R9 as well. The concept was for a quality, small, DAO, and powerful conceal carry gun. It is exactly what I was looking for. I thank the Rohrbaughs for putting it together. It is a great execution of it’s intended purpose, has to be remembered. The R9s is to carry in your pocket, the PM9 works great in a holster, the Kel-Tec guns are for plinking. The Kel-Tec guns are fun to shoot but questionable as to risking your life with one. I have two and have had serious problems with both.
Ken
Title: Re: Still Considering.....
Post by: jarcher on December 04, 2005, 12:01:46 PM: I have a KelTec P32 that works well, although I do worry about the .32 "rimlock" issue. I generally don;t carry the .32 because, well, it's a .32.

I know people with other KelTecs and I have to saw I think they are all, even mine, junk. I waited with great anticipation for the P3AT. When it turned out to be a lemon, I bought the R9s. I see the P3at is now in it's second incarnation and is still a lemon.

A friend of mine has a P-11. After three trips back to KT it's still goes click more than it goes bang.
Title: Re: Still Considering.....
Post by: WoodstockDoug on December 04, 2005, 12:55:20 PM: If you have a Black and Decker circular saw that you paid $39 for and it does everything you need it to do, there is almost no reason to buy a $300 Dewalt.

If your needs are more specialized, and you want a little more power and a lot higher quality, then you might spring for the far more expensive tool.

I moved up the the R9 from a Keltec P32 because I wanted both more power and more accuracy, and I was willing to pay four times the price for it. Is it 4 times as powerful? No. 4 times more accurate? No. And since my P32 was/is flawless so far, I can't say the R9 is more reliable, either.

And yet, yesterday I was looking at pocket knives on Ron Graham's forum that cost even more than a Kel-Tec, and there are knives out there that cost more than a R9. Are they worth it? Maybe to some, but I'm not ever likely to spend $250 on a pocket knife, unless I win the lottery, or have real reason to believe that I will have to defend my life with a knife in the immediate future. Neither of those situations is likely, so I'll stick with my little Chive and save my money for ammo.

No one else can tell you if a purchase is "worth it" to you. They can only tell you if it was "worth it" to them. You have to decide for yourself which you want more, your money or another really expensive gun.
Title: Re: Still Considering.....
Post by: Bubbaman on December 04, 2005, 05:25:05 PM: You know, I will say that the folks on this forum are very friendly and helpful. It's nice to join a forum and not have to jump through hoops to get, or stay, "activated". I have a 2nd Generation P-3AT that is great, but I will say that the lack of quality worries me. Will the first time that it doesn't go "BANG" be when I really need it? On the other hand, is there, when you consider the price of the R9, any difference? In other words, $250 pistol - 3 problems, $950 pistol - 1 problem.
Title: Re: Still Considering.....
Post by: DDGator on December 04, 2005, 09:41:47 PM: I wouldn't worry too much about the KT crapping out on you once you establish it is reliable. Parts can break -- but that can happen to anyone.

I hate to say it, but for higest reliability, a wheelgun may be the way to go.
Title: Re: Still Considering.....
Post by: Bubbaman on December 04, 2005, 09:58:09 PM: Ahhh - I don't like wheel guns much. Slim and trim is the way to go. I'm going to go through all my P-3AT parts and make sure everything is ok soon. For the most part my Springfield Micro Compact .40 will be my pocket gun for the winter. It's away at Fireblade Systems getting a new fitted trigger and trigger job, the front strap stippled, and the frame refinished. I know - it's not really a pocket gun, but it fits my jacket pocket fine (it actually will fit in the back pocket of some of my pants). Really, I'm leaning towards getting an R9-s. I'm being as patient as I can be to see what kinda deal I can find. I'm a small time FFL dealer and see a few guns, but since this would be MY gun, I can't just buy on a whim. I've done that too much already. I appreciate all of the feedback, and the pictures from R9SCarry. I don't think the R9-s would carry much differently than the P-3AT. Thanks again. 8)
Title: Re: Still Considering.....
Post by: tracker on December 04, 2005, 11:32:43 PM: Whatever charges your barge! I am much less analytical
and matrix oriented than you and just bought two R-9S
because I liked their style--then I signed on to this forum.
I have made some minor mistakes at times by going with the gut, but my nature is not to do paralysis by analysis.
Title: Re: Still Considering.....
Post by: Bubbaman on December 05, 2005, 12:17:21 AM: tracker - what are you going to do with 2 R9-s? One in each front or back pocket? :o
Title: Re: Still Considering.....
Post by: tracker on December 05, 2005, 12:24:28 AM: Case closed, Bubbaman; float your own boat; I was just
expressing my feelings.
Title: Re: Still Considering.....
Post by: Bubbaman on December 05, 2005, 12:58:53 AM: Tracker - I understand. I wasn't trying to offend you. I just thought it a little unusual to buy two R9s. But, I'd like to have two of alot of the pistols I own. ;)
Title: Re: Still Considering.....
Post by: tracker on December 05, 2005, 01:13:04 AM: I have those two, three Gold Cups, five BHP's, two Sigs,
a Beretta, a Para-Ordnance, a springfield, several old 1911's,
two HK P-7s, and many others. What's the big deal. I do not
own any Kel-Tecs, Kimbers, etc., nor will I.
Title: Re: Still Considering.....
Post by: tracker on December 05, 2005, 01:21:01 AM: Sorry, I forgot the three Glocks and I like every one of
those, too.
Title: Re: Still Considering.....
Post by: Bubbaman on December 05, 2005, 01:22:54 AM: Well, looks like we can agree on 1911s..........
Title: Re: Still Considering.....
Post by: tracker on December 05, 2005, 01:33:31 AM: Awwlll right!
Title: Re: Still Considering.....
Post by: harrydog on December 05, 2005, 08:38:55 AM: Quote

I hate to say it, but for higest reliability, a wheelgun may be the way to go.
Even that is debatable.
Title: Re: Still Considering.....
Post by: Aglifter on December 07, 2005, 12:20:17 AM: Personally, I got the R9 because it fit my hand -- same reason why my primary is a 1911 -- it's a Kimber, but I've put a couple thousand rounds through it, and not a problem yet, so... I don't know that I'd really trust a S&W... I had my 625 kinda feel "funny" a few times, like something inside was catching -- no such concerns on my SP101, customized by Gemini (thanks Duane)
I think reliability is most important, then fit... I worry about costs on "toy" guns, but I decided it was idiotic to consider it when it came to a carry gun -- that, and the R9 has proved to be the only gun I ALWAYS carry ( where permitted by law, of course)
Title: Re: Still Considering.....
Post by: tracker on December 07, 2005, 12:37:48 AM: Harrydog,
Most things are debatable and/or negotiable. I was just
trying to be agreeable for a change.
Title: Re: Still Considering.....
Post by: theirishguard on December 07, 2005, 09:19:27 AM: It is important to look at the R9s as a whole. 99+% are very happy with their pup. Only a few guns have had problems and Rohrbaugh is working on those.
I'm not worried about carrying mine and I have a lot of customers who agree with me.
Tom
Title: Re: Still Considering.....
Post by: Rocnerd on December 07, 2005, 12:03:55 PM: My R9s has been flawless since I got it. I carry it near everyday in my front pocket. I don't clean it untill after a trip to the range, which is about once a month with this gun. So, it goes from lint filled pocket for about two to four weeks to range time with anywhere from two mags to 50 rounds through it to clean and lube to pocket. No failures for the 9 months or so of this cycle.

So, for me the $900 price tag was worth it, and it is also very nice to fondle and just look at. When you hold one you will understand.

On a slightly different note I got a strange comment from someone at the range the last time. He said nice gun, but expensive for a 9mm. ? ??? Does that mean it wouldn't be expensive if it was a .45? I don't get it.
Title: Re: Still Considering.....
Post by: DDGator on December 07, 2005, 12:19:06 PM: Yes, I beleive that is exactly what that comment meant. People pay $1,000 and much more for guns in .45 ACP all the time, so it is more palatable... ???
Title: Re: Still Considering.....
Post by: tracker on December 07, 2005, 04:09:45 PM: That guy at the range should see the tag on a Sig 210.
Title: Re: Still Considering.....
Post by: Brenden on December 07, 2005, 07:25:38 PM: Quote
Yes, I beleive that is exactly what that comment meant. People pay $1,000 and much more for guns in .45 ACP all the time, so it is more palatable... ???

Yea-I see this and hear it all the time..
Although it is okay to spend a K on an HK P7M8,or a Walther P5.. ;) Even though they are 9s.. :)

I think some of it is the "size" too..Don't know why- but it is better to buy a Desert Eagle than a pocket rocket for the same price!! :o ;)
I own a couple of those listed above too.. ;D

My pup(s) have been a joy.. 8)

Brenden
Title: Re: Still Considering.....
Post by: Bubbaman on December 07, 2005, 07:44:44 PM: Well, I'm postponing buying a "Pup" for a while. I'm gonna try the Seecamp LWS .32 along with my Nighthawk for the time being. Then, I'll decide when to get the R9 and the LWS .380. I'll post a picture or two of my semi-pocket Springfield Micro Compact .40 when it gets back from Randy at Fireblade Systems. http://firebladesystems.com/
Title: Re: Still Considering.....
Post by: tracker on December 07, 2005, 10:47:12 PM: The thread rests.
Title: Re: Still Considering.....
Post by: tracker on December 08, 2005, 12:39:13 AM: Hopefully, it will not be resurrected by a purchase from
Bubbaman--not sure we could stand much more hand-
wringing and consultation. Vaya con Dios, Bubbaman.
Title: Re: Still Considering.....
Post by: Michigunner on December 08, 2005, 09:04:37 AM: I have to give him some credit. He does not jump into anything too fast. At times, I thought he was fooling with us, just a little bit.

tracker, you are a funny guy today, but you did not compromise the good friendly spirit found here on the forum. :)

Everytime I read your posts, I wish it was me who had "flung my craft through footless halls of air.......Where never the lark, nor even eagle flew".

I'm very envious that you are an aviator. It's so amazing that you can fly IFR without seeing the wing tips sometimes.

I probably would have been the dummy who tried to fly under the bridge.

Bill
Title: Re: Still Considering.....
Post by: Bubbaman on December 08, 2005, 09:09:22 AM: Oh.... I'm not gone. I'll be around some to check R&D, etc. Thanks again. 8)
Title: Re: Still Considering.....
Post by: theirishguard on December 08, 2005, 10:00:13 AM: I would spend that much time researching the product if I was buying a Lear jet. ::) :o
Tom
Title: Re: Still Considering.....
Post by: Bubbaman on December 08, 2005, 11:24:34 AM: :P
Title: Re: Still Considering.....
Post by: Bubbaman on August 28, 2007, 01:52:48 AM: Funny - I came back to check on the R9 and somehow this thread doesn't seem as funny as before. I don't remember saying one bad thing about Rohrbaugh and it's kinda like I got trashed for investigating...... :-/
Title: Re: Still Considering.....
Post by: ROKTMAN on August 28, 2007, 10:03:23 AM: Quote
I would spend that much time researching the product if I was buying a Lear jet. ::) :o
Tom
;D ;D
Title: Re: Still Considering.....
Post by: harrydog on August 28, 2007, 10:49:40 AM: Quote
Funny - I came back to check on the R9 and somehow this thread doesn't seem as funny as before. I don't remember saying one bad thing about Rohrbaugh and it's kinda like I got trashed for investigating...... :-/
I agree with you.
Don't get me wrong, I'm a Rohrbaugh fan and have been since before they even went into production. But there have definitely been more than a few R9's that have been unreliable. I had one of them. I don't blame you one bit for being hesitant about buying one.
Having said that, the Rohrbaugh brothers are great guys and will do whatever it takes to make your gun work. Sending the gun back to them multiple times is still painful though. Since the stronger magazine spring solution, the problem guns have mostly disappeared. Mine seems to be working 100% now. I now feel confident in recommending the R9 as a carry weapon, but that wasn't always the case.
Title: Re: Still Considering.....
Post by: Richard S on August 28, 2007, 11:06:10 AM: Bubbaman:

No one is trashing you for investigating. I believe you posted your first inquiries on the R9 back on November 25, 2005, in which you stated:

[size=10]I'm amazed at the number of posts, discussions, etc. concerning failures to feed, and the many other issues[/size].

You then asked about the R9's recoil compared to a pocket pistol chambered for .380 ACP, and that same day I posted the following response:

[size=10]Bubbaman:

Welcome to the Forum.

I own both the Guardian .380 and the R9. Bearing in mind that felt recoil is highly subjective, I find my G380's recoil, even with +P ammunition, to be a little less than that of my R9. I would describe the R9's recoil as "stout" but entirely manageable.

As to the cost of the R9, the best simply costs more -- more to manufacture and more to purchase. I have one of the first R9s sold to the public and am pleased to report that it has shown no vices. [/size]

That R9 I mentioned back on November 25, 2005, is in my pocket today. After three years and four months of service, it still has shown no vices.

I've been a regular follower of this Forum from its earliest days and can count on the fingers of one hand the number of R9s which have reportedly suffered from irreparable "defects." When one considers that the number of R9s produced is now approaching the 3,000 mark and that so-called "problem guns" will always generate more chatter on the boards and forums than those which are "well behaved," I personally have no concerns whatsoever about the R9's reliability. I trust my life and the life of my beloved little wife with mine. And in the odd event that some problem ever develops with my R9, I know that the factory will make it right.

Therefore, my advice would be as follows: If you want the smallest, lightest, most concealable, full-power 9mm pistol yet made -- a design now well-proven by more than three years of service -- get an R9, wrap it in some great leather, feed it a diet of gold (Dots or Sabers), and enjoy! 8)

(http://i2.photobucket.com/albums/y30/RichardS/r9at3yearswithgolddotshedleyleather.jpg)

Good luck to you.
Title: Re: Still Considering.....
Post by: Bubbaman on August 28, 2007, 11:11:28 AM: Thanks Richard for the kind response. That makes me feel alot better. My intentions were never to bash the R9. In fact, I really like what I've seen. I'm just a very "low maintenance" kind of guy. I don't need anything that requires alot of attention. Thanks again. ;)
Title: Re: Still Considering.....
Post by: Richard S on August 28, 2007, 11:41:06 AM: Quote
* * * I'm just a very "low maintenance" kind of guy. I don't need anything that requires alot of attention. Thanks again. ;)

Bubbaman:

You sound like one of my nephews. He's absolutely one of the best wing shots I've ever seen in my 70 years on this earth! If it's moving through the air within range of his shotgun, it's "toast" -- feathered or clay . . . no matter. And he does it with a Remington Model 1100 older than he is which he has wrapped in camouflage tape and keeps uncased on the floorboard behind the seat of his pickup truck. His idea of cleaning the gun is to wipe it down now and then with an oily rag -- the same rag he uses to check his motor oil. But it's a real hoot to watch him give lessons in humility to some of my friends around here with their four-figure engraved and inlaid shotguns.

I've let him shoot my R9, but I'd never let him take it out of my sight. ;)
Title: Re: Still Considering.....
Post by: DTM_39 on August 28, 2007, 11:50:25 AM: Richard, Your nephew sounds like my grandpa. He used to clean the barrel by putting a round through it. I still have some of his old guns and they still shoot just fine. I'm sort of in the middle. I clean them once in a while but not as much as I should. Dan
Title: Re: Still Considering.....
Post by: Bubbaman on August 28, 2007, 11:59:33 AM: Oh, I clean my guns. I'm a little bit anal about my stuff. What I meant by low maintenance was that I read a couple of years ago that you needed to keep grease on the outside of the barrel, replace the springs every 100 rounds, etc. I want to be able to clean the thing up, shoot the heck out of it, and repeat. I think the R9 is meant to be fired enough to be familiar, but carried more than fired. 8)
Title: Re: Still Considering.....
Post by: DTM_39 on August 28, 2007, 12:36:12 PM: Bubbaman, I believe the grease if laid on to thick used to gum things up. The reco was to go with the oil. I clean and lube every 50 rounds. I believe the current reco on the recoil spring is 200 rounds. I'm sure somebody will correct me if that figure is wrong. The gun gets hot so you should let it cool off after a couple of mags. Dan
Title: Re: Still Considering.....
Post by: Richard S on August 28, 2007, 03:20:14 PM: Quote
Richard, Your nephew sounds like my grandpa. He used to clean the barrel by putting a round through it. I still have some of his old guns and they still shoot just fine. I'm sort of in the middle. I clean them once in a while but not as much as I should. Dan

Dan:

Now that Taps have been played for the two sergeants in question, I am at liberty to say that I once knew a grizzled old armorer who had a special way of cleaning firearms when no one was around to see. His process involved a certain 55-gallon drum which his buddy in charge of the headquarters motor pool allowed him to keep there under a tarp, ostensibly out of sight and out of mind. The drum was filled with what might euphemistically be called "surplus" gasoline. The armorer referred to his gun-cleaning technique as "expeditious total immersion."

How did I hear about any of that? Let's just say that "stuff" occasionally happens, and some of that "stuff" is brought to the attention of an Army division's chief of military justice. 8)
Title: Re: Still Considering.....
Post by: DTM_39 on August 29, 2007, 03:25:45 PM: Richard , I hope that old armorer waited for the guns to dry before he fired them. Dan