The Rohrbaugh Forum
Miscellaneous => Other Guns => Topic started by: DDGator on November 07, 2005, 10:37:15 AM
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I like S&W guns. I started on revolvers and still love them too.
The first 9mm I ever shot was a S&W Model 69. I remember my friends who were cops carrying 59s, 659s, and 5906s. I always liked the look and feel of them -- including the traditional double action (TDA). I guess having learned on wheel guns, the longer DA first pull of a TDA gun never bothered me.
At the gunshow this weekend I picked up a S&W 3913 TSW. I had a 6906 for a while, but felt it was a bit thick for carry. This single-stack 3913 with 8+1 should carry very nice.
Any other S&W auto fans here?
Here is my take on the much maligned S&W autos. S&W started the trend of 9mm autos for cops. Many, many cops made the wheelgun to autoloader transition on S&W guns. However, a few things happened in the early 1990s. The type of LEO changed a lot -- more educated types, more women, more people who were not "gun people" became cops. Basic LEO training was not all that sophisticated or involved. Many departments wanted to "dumb down" (sorry -- no offense intended to anyone) the carry guns into DAO or safe action types, minimizing controls. Also, the easier to field-strip, the more likely an uninterested LEO would be to at least make a pretense of cleaning the gun. Further, the increased use of equipment--radios, extend-a-batons, chemical spray, etc. meant more weight on the belt and a savings of a pound or two (by using plastic) seemed attractive. All of these things, together with a low price, pushed a lot of departments into Glocks.
Meanwhile, S&W continues to produce high quality, very serviceable semi-autos with steel and alloy frames that get largely ignored.
Whatcha think? ;)
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Duane, I had a great S&W 9mm auto. Sorry, can't remember the model. Seems like it was 439, or something like that.
It was too thick for my smaller hands, otherwise it never would have been traded.
I went to the gun store some time ago to buy the Chief's Special 45 auto. Sadly, the finger reach was just a little too much.
Manufacturers should be like H&K, and have provisions for different size hands.
S&W should be able to do that.
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S&W has incorporated interchangeable back-strap sizes into their polymer framed service guns.
I agree that grip shape is important and can be a deal breaker. I hate the new Glock frames with finger grooves -- they don't hit my fingers right.
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I remember the S&W back straps. It's too bad they can't do that for metal guns. I would gladly pay extra.
"deal breaker" is exactly right. These poor folks are loosing tons of money because they are ignoring the consumers who have different hand sizes.
Sig tried to help some by developing the short trigger, which enabled me to successfully use the P239.
Maybe someone, somewhere has a "short trigger" for the CS45 which is reminiscent of the pistol seen in the old Dick Tracy comic strip. Now that was a real gun.
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The only S&W auto I have ever used was a DA/SA .45 that my friends father carried when his dept switched from revolver to autos. It gave me the impression of a heavy sloppy gun that wasn't very accurate. Of course that is the only experience that I have had with S&W autos. They have also never been all that aesthetically pleasing to my eye. I do like the look of the new M&P though.
I can say though that between my friend and I we put close to 1500 rounds through it in a relatively short period of time and never had a problem with it. Who knows how many rounds total it has, as it was carried on duty for many years and shot fairly frequently.
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I'm a big fan of S&W autoloaders -- especially their third generation models and they are my most frequent carried CCW. Before change in ownership, I was an admin over on the S&Wforums and I hung out mostly in the auto forum. Below are SOME of my S&W autoloaders ...
(http://fud-files.netfirms.com/image/private/guns/f126.jpg)
... missing from the photo is another 1006 and a pair of 4506's.
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Fudster,
Nice pictures.
Do you know if they can make a modified trigger for smaller hands that have to stretch slightly to reach the trigger?
Bill
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Not really sure but if you can track down an older 3913TSW (the ones without the rail and which had a 7+1 capacity), they were slightly more compact than the current 3913TSW's and I suspect they might fit your hand without a problem. I've got three of them ...
(http://fud-files.netfirms.com/image/private/guns/f23.jpg)
... but mine aren't for sale (one is a practice gun, one is my carry gun and one is a virgin gun).
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I might even call the S&W Custom Shop. They might have some ideas.
I suppose you could have metal removed from the forward portion of the trigger, somewhat like the Sig short trigger.
However, the triggers look thin already.
Bill
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I currently have 5 semis, all in 10mm. They're built like tanks and are quite accurate. I think they're very high quality and I wouldn't hesitate in getting another S&W semi-auto.
Fudster - nice collection!
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>>I have a few Smith Autos included in my collection. Most recently picked up an older 3913...nice handling gun and very accurate.
My favorite Smith is a Performance Center .356 ...as pictured below...and one of I think 500 made. Although I have a store of .356 ammo,I usually shoot .9mm out of it - which is quite accurate itself...TW<<
(http://photos.imageevent.com/trooper/miscstuff/websize/SandW%20356.jpg)
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That is one nice looking gun TW!
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TW -- Let me know if you ever want to part with that beauty... ;D
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Terrific pistol. I want one, too.
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I love S&W wheelguns. My 686 will never be sold.
But as far as pistols, I probably won't own a S&W because the safety is:
1. Slide mounted and I have sliced my fingers racking the slide on a 1006.
2. The safety works the reverse of my other safety- or decocker- equipped guns.
Walking and chewing gum is enough of a challenge for me. A reverse manual of arms is just asking for trouble - for me, at least. :-[
BTW: That 1006 with full power loads was a dream to shoot. It really got me started on hand gunning in the modern era. I kinda wish I had bought a S&W auto first. I WANT to buy American. When I tell friends I have a Rohrbaugh R9S, they ask me when I'm going to quit buying German guns!!
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Oh my <drool> some lovely stuff here - Alan - you do not have enough S&W auto's LOL!! ::) :P
Never (as yet) been tempted to Smith for these - bit like Steve the manual of arms subtleties have put me off tho - that said I have a SW99 but that is in a different class - it's a P99 near as dammit!
I'd not rule them out but at my late stage in life - not likely now. I am tho again like Steve - big into Smith wheelguns :)
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One of my most accurate 9mms is a 3913 LS.. :)
It is a nice shooting gun and I bought it a LONG time ago before any of the "political stuff" went on there..
I liked its "thin-ness" and enjoyed it a lot!!
Has not been shot for forever and a day now though.. :(
Brenden
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http://www.truthaboutparts.blogspot.com/
Check it out guys---speak your piece.
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Tracker - the pics speak for themselves!!!! Teddy's comments were ''safe for web'' - knowing as I do how he would talk about such things on the phone! ;D
Be great to need your Kimber super 1911 in a hurry and find extractor claw bust off!!
I remember my old S&W 1917 (in .455) and the delight in looking inside at the lockwork - it was a joy to behold. I even then was aware that there was not quite the finesse within my early M27 - still good tho.
But now - well, MIM anmd skimping together do not breed huge confidence I must say. Cost cutting has its dangers.
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I checked out the pics on Ted's blog. Pretty scary looking parts, eh? My 686 has good parts in it, tho not jeweled like the gun in the "good" picture - just case hardened. The other Smith & Wesson revolver is a J-Frame w/concealed hammer. It didn't look as attractive as the bigger gun, but nothing was broken either....
As for the MIM parts - they can be extremely strong, thus reliable. Almost all modern engines have sintered connecting rods & many have sintered cam lobes. Those components are tremendously stressed and failures are almost unheard of.
Of course, I had just bought a NAA Guardian .380 when I read a test in one of the major gun mags. You guessed it, the MIM trigger broke putting the gun out of action. It took about 500 rounds before I began to relax, figuring I wouldn't suffer an "infant mortality" failure.
Bottom line is: Everyone must watch costs or go out of business. Manufacturers just have to make sure their products are reliable. Gun manufacturers better be dead sure - or their customers may just be dead.
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One of my first guns was a S&W 3913 (actually a gift from my soon-to-be wife at that time.) I wanted it caused I planned to carry, and I thought the 6906 was a little thick. Had the gun worked on by S&W performance shop (reliability package, including trigger work and night sights). This was all before you could buy a TSW or Performance center piece.
Carried in a Milt Sparks Summer special (as it gets hot here in S. Fla!) and even saved my life once!
I still have that gun, even though it now has been replaced by others.
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I also love their revos, and I think their semiautos are some of the best deals out there. I'm wearing my 1076 as I type this, in fact. :D
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Hi DDGator,
I am new to the forum and just doing some browsing looking for subjects that I can relate to, and share some interest. I own a 952-1 from the S&W Performance Center. I compare this pistol with my Sig P210 and I am on most given days more accurate with the 952. I believe it is due to the additional weight. The trigger is a compliment as well, although the 210 also has a great trigger. Both are built with very tight tolerences. When one goes to the range the other follows for ongoing comparison. I personnally will never be as accurate as the potential of these two pistols and that helps to keep my craving down to purchase more autos. ;D
Photos of my two favorite 9mms.
Kindest Regards, Fred
210 & 952
(http://i33.photobucket.com/albums/d85/dctfn/DSCF0796.jpg)
(http://i33.photobucket.com/albums/d85/dctfn/DSCF0790.jpg)
(http://i33.photobucket.com/albums/d85/dctfn/DSCF0779.jpg)
Fred - edited to separate the pics more :) )
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Although I wasn't looking for a revolver I found a
686 in the box with paperwork that was too good
to resist. It is one of one thousand Customs Service
revolvers and a real sweetheart; never say never!
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(http://i9.photobucket.com/albums/a73/Laserlips/100_5170.jpg)
(http://i9.photobucket.com/albums/a73/Laserlips/100_5265.jpg)
;D
Best Wishes,
J. Pomeroy
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What's the scoop on the S&W 1911?
Why did they go with an external extractor?
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While I don't know S&W's reasoning on the external extractor, I prefer it because:
1) It is easier to get the proper "tension" on an external extractor.
2) When an external extractor breaks, it will fly away from the gun, and the gun will continue to function, and the shooter won't even notice until looking at the slide later.
I have shot the S&W original 1911 and really think they did their 1911 right. If they ever come out with a version of their present 4" barrel scandium gun with an officer-size grip, I will have to give it some serious thought. I really like the fact that this gun has a standard bushing instead of the barrel fitted directly to the slide. When the gun starts to shoot loose, just replace the bushing and it will be good as new.