The Rohrbaugh Forum
Rohrbaugh Products and Accessories => Rohrbaugh R9 (all variations) => Topic started by: MoW on January 30, 2005, 03:44:58 PM
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OK, I'm considering the R-9s as a CCW. I've been doing alot of research lately and looked at many different options. My question comes as compared to the S&W 340 PD. Price is not a concern, and there is little difference in price anyway. Convince me, why would I choose the R-9s over the 340 PD----both are light weight(12oz), the R-9s shoots 1 more round, but the 340 PD shoots a more powerful caliber(yes, I know accuracy is more important then caliber) and there is virtually no chance of the 340 PD of ever jamming. Convince me, I'm not trying to flame, just asking questions. Thanks.
MoW
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HI MoW.
I doubt that you will find many people on this forum that will throw rocks at the S&W 340PD, it's a superb pocket gun, especially with CT grips. In fact, many of us, myself included, are J-Frame fans as well as Rohrbaugh fans.
If a decision has to be made between the two, the decision may simply come down to what do you like best, or what do you shoot best, a wheelgun or an auto?
As far as convincing you, I don't want to do that, but I will mention that the Rohrbaugh is a little flatter in the pocket, and about 1" shorter. Also, I don't mean to be picky, but the 340PD is a 5 shot, while the Rohrbaugh is a SEVEN shot, with 6 in the mag. and one more already in the tube.
Honestly, both are great little guns, and personally, I think you should carry the Rohrbaugh in your right pocket and the Smith in your left pocket! ;D Whatever you decide, good shooting to you, and welcome to the forum!
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Thanks for the welcome. I really didn't expect anybody to rag on the 340 PD--just curious as to which they would opt for and why. Honestly, the 7 vs 5 does appeal to me but so does the .357 vs 9mm and the security of the no jam. Both seem to be great guns.
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self-defense considerations aside, have you considered the
effect on your hearing from firing a .357 magnum without
protection?
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The Scandium J-frame .357 is one of very, very few guns I have ever fired that I found painful.
I tried the gun at a S&W event at a local shooting range. Upon firing the first round, the cylinder latch was driven into my thumb hard enough to draw blood. I used up the next four rounds trying to figure out how to keep from bleeding while also hitting my target. My hits on a full-size silhouette target were peripheral at best.
Both guns may be equally lightweight, but I think that in terms of size you will find the S&W more comparable to a Glock 26 than to a true pocket gun like a Rohrbaugh.
For comparison, I own a 3" .44 mag., and I have shot .454 Casull and .50 AE with no difficulty.
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I feel the Rohrbaugh R9 is far more concealable that any S&W J frame. I own about two dozen J's, but only one R9..
Welcome to the Forum, MoW
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MoW:
One of the oldest arguments in magazines is J Frame vs. auto. As an instructor, I recommend revolvers, (to beginners), because of simplicity.
Old timer cops like wheel guns better than autos and women like them too. (Don't mean to stereotype; just relating my experience).
The S&W airweights I owned were painful to shoot, particularly the titanium frame .44 Special. My favorite was the little Ruger SP101. A little rough, out of the box, but durable, accurate and reliable. I wish I had kept it and sent it to charm school for trick out by a gunsmith.
I have not received my R9S yet but the question you raise is fair. Why don't you buy both?
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Pictured below is my R9S next to my S&W342 ...
(http://fud-files.netfirms.com/image/private/guns/_r9sw342.jpg) (http://fud-files.netfirms.com/image/private/guns/r9sw342.jpg)
... which is basicly the same size as the 340 but in .357mag instead of .38special. I have had this gun seize up on me when doing rapid fire (loaded 5 rounds and fired them off as quickly as I could. Quickly loaded another five rounds and repeated. After about half a box, the gun seized up and the cylinder wouldn't turn no could I pull the trigger). After a couple of minutes of cooling off, the gun was operational again. I consider that worse than a jam because you are literally stopped. With a jam, you can quickly unjam it and continue.
Repeated the same drill with the R9S and it worked flawlessly. In my book, that makes the R9S more reliable than the 342/340 (the 340 is basicly the same gun as the 342 expect in .357 instead of .38)
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Fudster makes a good point about reliability. Those who favor revolvers sometimes like to point out that revolver training doesn't involve malfunction clearance. In my own experience, when a revolver goes down, it is usually can't be rectified without a trip back to the factory for repair.
I have generally found that women do better wtih semiautos because of the typically lighter trigger pulls. About 40% of the women I have either taken shooting or encountered at the range had great difficulty working with trigger pulls over 9 lb.
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I have a friend that has the 340 S&W in .357. Let me say that firing this round in this light of a package is not for the squimish. You also need to find the right loads because of bullet jump. i shot just one rnd. and knew that was it for me.
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I own both and find that the R-9 conceals much better. It fits pockets that my 340sc has is grips peeking out about a 1/2 inch. I wear long shirts out of habit because of this, but now it's nice to not have to worry about flashing.(not that an occasional flash ever hurts)
I have some pants that I can conceal my Glock 27 in, but that's another topic.
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Everyone:
I have the answer to all your woes as to J-frame revolver vs. R9 for CCW. Just move to New Jersey! There is no right to carry in New Jersey. There is one legal way to carry a handgun and that is to and from the range PERIOD. You cannot carry the pistol on your person enroute to the range nor can the gun be loaded. If so, you committed a felony. Pistol & ammo must be stored in your vehicle in separate areas, or you committed a felony. Stop at a 7-11 or to get your car filled with gas, while conveying a handgun, and you committed a felony. Anyone wish to move to New Jersey?
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Aren't New Jersey, Illinois and California part of the "Evil Empire" or is it "The Axis of Evil"?
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I think it's like the C&W song, "Am I Blue?".
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The worst states for gun laws, as I understand them:
1. New Jersey
2. Illinois
3. Hawaii
If I'm wrong, shoot me, but make sure you do it in New Jersey. Why? Because in NJ you are more likely to be prosecuted as a gun owner than you are as a criminal.
I've stated elsewhere in this forum why I am committed to living in NJ and I will not miss it when that commitment is fulfilled. :'(
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MoW - welcome :)
Phil (PCA) is right re what he (we) teach in NRA etc ... the small revo is eminently more suitable for folks starting off... plus the reliability factor too - after which perhaps they can manage a small semi - and as RJ I think mentions, that is (IMO too) way more ''pocketable''. I use SP-101 a lot - summer in particular .. and happen to like weight too funnily enough - no Scandiums for me!
Then there is capacity - on balance I'll take the 6+1 of the R9 in preference to the J frame type revo - tho often my SP-101 seems enough - the R9 often ''tags along'' tho as BUG! Just now I am using my SIG 226ST as carry - but light clothing will make that a nono later!
Phil - the ''bad'' states ... HI-yes, IL-yes, NJ-yes ... but add too MD ... and from a carry standpoint KS is lacking miserably IMO. CA is of course (as Doc states) also totally anal about most aspects of guns in most places!
Some aspects of NY leave something to be desired (IMO) ... and it hardly seems MO and OH have yet gotten themselves properly organized.
As for cities ... well, I'd better not wax too much on Chicago, DC etc .... might needeed censored! LOL.
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Chris,
I should have seen Maryland on the horizon from the posting on the forum by the guy who was held up because Maryland had not defined R9 as legal. But, hey; at least he's got an R9 now.
I am grateful to the forum allowing me to complain about NJ because I am locked into living in NJ while my father lives to whom I am obligated as caregiver.
I drive 50 miles each way to work, while the PA border is only 18 miles away from my office. I would have moved to the Keystone State years ago were I not morally obligated.
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Take your father with you and MOVE. That's what I did with my Mom. I highlighted the negatives of NJ. Minimized the postives and did vice versa with Florida.
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Fudster: Your recommendation is reasonable but I have been there and done that. My father is intransigent and he shuts down all dialog pertaining to alternative locations. My family has been in the town for four (4) generations and whatever contact my father has, with the outside world, takes place there.
I do what I do to give back to the people who raised me, as I did for my mother prior to her passing away. I only wished the state in which I am temporarily forced to reside were more progressive as regards gun laws.
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Ahh, that brings me back to my very young days duck hunting with my dad saying "dad I wish some ducks would come in", his reply, "son if you wish in one hand and sh** in the other which one would fill up first?" I am the guy in Maryland who is trying to get the R9 approved for sale by the handgun board. We are still working on it .
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Newt,
I thought you resolved that matter. Sure you're not just trying to make me feel better about NJ?
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The Md. handgun board meets again on Feb. 16 at which time a R9 will be inspected and considered for sale, if it meets the criteria set forth by the board. I think it will be approved but you never know about the whims of big brother. I will keep y'all posted on what happens. :-/
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Newt:
I'll be routing for the good guys who will be R9 owners.
Who are the people who will meet on the Md board to discuss/decide in favor of the R9?
Are there any friendlies on this board or is it comprised of bureacrats only?
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I moved down here to S. Fl about two years ago from NJ. NJ is a great state aside from the gun laws. Close to Philly and NYC. Great beaches, mountains, Delaware river, NJ corn and tomatoes. I was going to say I don't miss anything but my friends and family, but I guess that would be a lie. That being said, I would not live there again by choice. Once I got to florida and bought my first handgun without a "permit to puchase a handgun" I was hooked. Now, you can carry legally in NJ, you just have to get written permission from your state senator, so I've heard. My friend's father carries in NJ, but is retired PD and is a traffic investigator for the state.
Sorry MoW for totally hijacking your thread.
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Rocnerd:
I hear you on the corn and tomatos but they grow so well in NJ because of all the fertilizer emanating from Trenton.
It takes a Superior Court judge to allow a CCW in NJ. There are 1200 licenses to carry in NJ who are not former police officers. (The right for former police officers to carry took a separate law years to pass).
When you divide 1200 by a population of 8 million, that's .00015 of the civilian population who are entitled to legally carry a handgun.
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PCA, the board has one state tropper,one lawyer, and a liason person for the govenors office plus ordinary citizens, 10 in all I think. The good news is they have yet to turn down a request, so I think the chances are very good.
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Newt:
In NJ the State police control firearms transactions. When the NICS law came through, in 1999, NJ vetoed it because it was too convenient for gun owners!
Then, diabolically, NJ imposed its own NICS check @ $15.00 per transaction.
What does this all mean? Quadruple redundancy for handgun purchase. This is what we go through:
1) Firearms ID card,with fingerprinting 2) Pistol Permit (for EVERY handgun you ever purchase), 3) NJ NICS check, 4) NICS check waiting period up to 72 hours.
You can't make this stuff up.
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We still have a one a month limit on handguns and a 7 day waiting period.
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Newt,
We are on an obvious "can you top this?" mode. Reality is that we both loose because MD and NJ law makers don't know and don't care about gun owners.
When they restrict gun ownership in a blue state, the population applauds because the anti-gunners paint us as the bad guys and the blithering idiotic press goes along with it.
Meanwhile, Rosie O'Donnell conducts the Million Mom March, against firearms, while she is protected by an armed bodyguard.
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Basically Phil - it sucks being a mere peon! >:(
Don't get me started on Rosie O'D - shucks. ::)
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Chris,
Rosie thinks the world of you. Why do you think she pulled off the million mom march in PA?
And now, the good news.....(Okay there is no good news).
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Chris,
I didn't know that you were friends with Rosie. Why don't you post some photos.
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Yeah! Chris is an extraordinary photographer. Why not a snap shot of "Ruger Rosie"?
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Haha - friends!? Yeah right! Even my ''photoshop'' skills couldn't make a pic of her presentable. ;D
(Banning guns is like banning s-p-o-o-n-s cos they make Rosie O'D fat''!) :D
Had to expand that word cos the 'naughty words deal' made it into ''thingies''!!!
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Chris,
Rosie is just misunderstood and she needs a guy with a big gun.
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I think she would prefer a woman with a rubber gun. :o
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I own a SP101 in 357 with hogue grips, it is a great firearm, reliable, powerful and a good substitute for a club if you run out of ammo. It is also, heavy, hurts like hell with full loads and spends most of its life in my safe. I am interested in an RS9 but I've heard several negative things, first in Gun Tests, then on the net, some state that the chambers & barrels are over bored, etc etc. So I put off buying one. After that nut in the Kingston mall, well, one well placed shot would have ended it all. So all you people giving it accolades "convince me" also. And thanks to all.
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Welcome shooter :) Read far and wide on this lil' pup ... sure Gun Tests slammed it rather but you want to delve deeper on that - search this forum.
Beyond that - American handgunner did a review which i think we all agreed was a lot better balanced.
Go also and read (in my sig) some odds and ends of info on my FAQ site - other links there too ... to some ammo tests. Get the broad picture and I think you'll find the R9 is quite some puch packer for its size as well as being of extreme quality.
Note BTW if you check on FAQ site ... the 1/4" freebore is a necessary design aspect ... even tho it might make a few bullets slightly prone to tumble on occasion.
We still reckon, ''specials'' and frangibles aside ... the pup loves the taste of Gold Dots!!
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As I stated the SP101 spends more time in my safe. As long as there is ONE brand of totally reliable ammo, well, this is a pocket piece, not meant to be a target gun. As long as I can hit the bad guy at 25 feet, I am convinced. Thank you.