The Rohrbaugh Forum
Rohrbaugh Products and Accessories => Rohrbaugh R9 (all variations) => Topic started by: rooster on April 02, 2005, 09:52:56 AM
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Hi guys just needed some place to vent. I am starting to have doubt about getting the r9. I have been waiting since November, I have bought ammo and 2 holsters waiting for this pistol to come to my dealer. Now they are having a price increase, and no sign of shipping any guns. I am seriously considering the Kahr pm9. There is a gun show in my area the 3rd week in April, and there is a dealer there that has 2 r9s in stock but he wants 1125.00 for them. I need to trade a pistol because I don't have that kind of cash. I am going to get one or the other at that show. But 1125.00 is starting to get ridiculous. I know that this is a really nice pistol but reality is starting to set in.
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Rooster, I know the frustration in waiting for anything. First, the R9 is worth the wait. Second, the price increase is only on guns ordered after 3/31/05. Third, does your dealer have the gun priced at an amount you can live with? Fourth, the Rohrbaugh folks are shipping guns and catching up on orders! Check with your dealer and find out when he ordered the gun you are waiting on. If it was in November, you will see one most likely late summer. Just a guess! But it is still worth the wait. Some of my customers waited an additional 4-5 months to get their guns after the move to a new larger plant. They all are enjoying their R9's. All of us with R9s have gone thru the wait and are happy we did that. Tom
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That price you quote sounds rather like profiteering! Those two R9's would have been in stock pre price increase and so should be available at the original price or near too it.
I would be inclined to challenge this, although of course, any dealer can charge whatever he/she wants to - but this seems decidedly excessive.
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http://www.gunsamerica.com/guns/976561243.htm
are these still in stock?
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When I asked the dealer in question about why he was asking 1125.00 when the manufacturer's retail price was in the 900.00 range I was told that if I could get one he would give me the difference. I looked at the guns on the gunsamerica website but I need to trade a pistol and do the difference in cash. I will probably wait but its just getting really starting to get at me. Thanks guys.
Rooster
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Like everything else the supply and demand thing is happening..The waiting is worth it though if you can hang in there.. ;)
Good luck.. :)
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You should take the leap to buying and selling online and forget that local trade-in racket.
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Rooster,
Like you I ordered my R9 in November. I finally gave up and cancelled the order. I had a change of heart and decided I NEEDED one and I am now on the Irish Guard's waiting list.
I am lucky enough to live close by and also lucky that he had a spot open.
I almost bought a R9 on gunbroker.com. They have had several that started in the high $800's. Not sure what they sold for, but I bet it was less than the $1125, you are being quoted.
I tried contacting Arego's (gunsamerica.com) and they kept telling me to call them. I emailed and said I could not call from work. He sounded like he had the R9 in stock.
Anyway, I was frustrated, but things will work out now.
If you decide you really need this gun, you will find a way.
BamaTex
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Rooster,
Why not post your trade in gun in the classifieds section of this forum? It may be that someone here has a need for it and you will both be happy.
I have learned never to trade in squat. If you do it with a car, you get hosed. Same thing with anything else. It's just my opinion, but if you are waiting anyway, why not try to sell it straight out? Doesn't seem like you would have much to lose. Plus, if you do sell it, your dependency on this gun dealer goes away.
Just something to think about.
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Yes, R-9s are definitely being shipped -- don't fret about that.
$1,125 is ridiculous, charge what the market will bear, profiteering. Its the same guys that were selling Kel-Tec P-3ATs for $400...
I had the same situation when I bought my Chrysler PT Cruiser when they were first released. I could pay a $4k premium over full sticker price to get one on the lot, or order one and wait 4 months for the privilege of paying full sticker. I waited, but it was tough. Did I overpay for the car? Yes -- but I got enough fun and "wow" factor out of it to make up the difference. ;D
If you will have the R-9 for the rest of your life (or even the next 10 years), the wait of another few weeks or even months will be insignificant. If you give up now, I tend to think you will regret it -- and then you will pay the higher price.
A Kahr is a fine gun, but it is NOT an R-9 by any means... ::)
Sell your "trade" on-line. I have bought and sold a lot of guns this way, with no problem. Selling, particularly, is nearly risk free since you get the money up-front. Give it a try -- selling is much easier than buying.
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I can identify with your frustration! I ordered an R-9s in August of 2004. I was told at the time that the "official" wait time was five months, but I should have it in 3 to 4. As we roll into the eighth month, my frustration is mounting! I know, I know...factory move, SHOT show, etc...still; it doesn't make the wait any easier.
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Fireboy, You should be getting your R9 in the next few weeks. I'll bet! Tom
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Fireboy - welcome. :)
Like Tom, I'd reckon you will not have too much longer to wait. Long haul I will admit but - this must be pretty much a home run now. Hang in there.
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Fireboy and Rooster, Let me help you feel better. I have had a R9S laying in my FFL's safe for about 3 1/2 mos. now and after a long process of getting Maryland to approve it for sale,in mid Feb., then waiting another 30days for possible objections finally today I get to send off my paper work for another 7 business day,weekend days don't count, which is really 2wks wait to pick up my Rohrbaugh. Meantime I am waiting to hear from the MSP if my carry permit will be approved which is subject to the whim of the Sec. of the MSP. If you are in a "shall issue" state be happy and wait for the best carry gun there is, R9S,. Be thankfull that you will not be subjected to these hurdles I have had to jump!
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All of us with R9s have gone thru the wait and are happy we did that. Tom
You guys are making me guilty that I did NOT go through any kind of wait to get my R9S :D. Literally, the day I decided that I was going to own one, I found a dealer with one and it shipped to my FFL that day; I picked it up the following day ;D! I'm sure glad though, cause I'm not the kind who'd wait months like you guys are. If you can endure the wait, I'm sure you'll be pleased when you do get your R9.
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Thaks guys for all your input. I have decided that I will get a r9 somehow. I am going to the gun show in April and I will see what kind of a deal I can work out with the dealer that has 2 in stock. If that doesn't work I will wait it out. Newt I really feel for you, that is having one and can't get it.Wow!
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I broke down and called the factory early this week. I'm trying to resist the temptation phone every week as to not hinder them from making pistols!! Anyway, I talked to a very nice lady who reported that they had just received some barrels that they we waiting on and that I should get a call within the next couple of weeks to tell me how many more weeks it would be!! About to start on the ninth month of waiting......
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[size=13] I talked to a very nice lady[/size]
That I reckon would have been ''our'' Maria! :) That news should hopefully mean your waiting is gonna draw to a close before too long.
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Fireboy, It is just around the corner now. Tom
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I talked to a very nice lady who reported that they had just received some barrels that they we waiting on
Does this mean they are outsourcing their barrels now?
Last I've heard:
1. The grips are outsourced, where I don't know
2. Checkmate Industries makes the magazines
3. The frames are sent out for anodizing
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Maybe Maria meant the bar stock for the barrels -- the barrels are cut on machines at the factory.
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I know its frustrating. I sent all the money in last August. But, this isn't just another gun. I have friends that wait 12 months to have "race guns", when they ship the pistol to start with.
Besides, there is no one I need to shoot right now. If so, I'll use one of my big, bulky pistols. Kerry
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Oh, I feel certain that the R-9s will be worth the wait! But, since ordering last August I have purchased a Glock 17, sent it to Cylinder & Slide for full house work, then to Robar for NP3 finish and got it back about 3 weeks ago.
I think it is being so close....but not quite there yet!
(BTW, Great board guys. I really enjoy it.)
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Zamboni - I think your angst is well understandable. Dealers who cannot and do not keep their customers happy - well, at least informed - are harming their reputation and so potentially also their business as a whole.
I am no dealer of course but - I think I would try and keep a calendar or journal - with ''expected'' dates for incoming guns - that way a call to customer could be made to keep them up to speed if delays.
All too often it seems, due dates are over optimistic - maybe to ensure getting orders. That is counter-productive IMO if in the end it seems they were transparently wrong. Those things called trust, respect, loyalty and integrity are for me, integral parts of a good business - shown/earned in many ways but including keeping customers up to speed and returning calls etc.
I just hope this will resolve, satisfactorily in the end - you with the gun you want and not out of pocket. I could have sold one of my pups a few times over already I think but - hope to try and keep both a good while yet.
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Hey you guys, I know it is hard but these little guns are worth the wait. I am so glad that I didn't get the Kahr pm9. I really hope that they start shipping your guns soon. I was really starting to get antse and thought about giving but I am glad that I waited. For anyone who is wanting one The place that I got mine has one more, however there is a catch he wants 1125.00. It was weapons unlimited in Apopka Fl.
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Call Maria and ask who might have one in stock. I don't know how you guys can stand waiting on a local dealer when you don't have to.
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Hi Guys, well I am glad to see I am not alone.. I placed my order at the beginning of November and was told 5 to 6 months.. I called my dealer two weeks ago and I am still waiting to hear back.. Based on what I read here I think I know why, he had nothing good to tell me.. It appears as though guns are shipping at least, just a jump in orders. But I will probably not see my pistol till the end of the summer, then like others here I will have to wait for the county to approve adding it to my permit.. :'(
Typo623
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Typo - welcome here. Sorry you are (yet another) frustrated by the long wait - but no real way round it, unless you happen across a dealer with one or two spares.
The wait is tho worthwhile most of us would agree. Stick around - have a good browse thru old posts etc ... and hope to look forward to (eventually) welcoming you to the owner's club too. :)
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Typo, Welcome, you are right you should get your R9 about the end of the summer or a little sooner. Most likely Aug or Sept. Tom
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Thanks for the replies, I am going to hang in, I have plenty to keep me protected in the mean time.. I will admit, if this was my first carry gun I might be getting a little more antsy. Anyway I am looking forward to becoming an owner of one of these little guns, and joining the club after all the positive I have read about it.. Typo623 :)
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Hey all!! I heard from the factory today. Two to three more weeks...maybe. ;D
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Great!! I know Eric told me things were really beginning to pick up a pace so - here's hopin'!! :)
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Hey all!! I heard from the factory today. Two to three more weeks...maybe. ;D
Congratulations! Got a holster picked out for the pup yet? If not, there's no time like the present!
;D
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Wayne,
As a matter of fact I have two already and am very pleased with both. No. 1 is a brown leather from RJ Hedley and No. 2 is a black stingray from K&D. Both are pocket holsters. Can't wait to have something to put in them!!!
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Fireboy
A smart move, and you can't loose. Even if you didn't receive the R9, the holsters are easy to move here on this site..
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My gun dealer went to the first SHOT Show the Rohrbaughs attended. He brought home the brochure. At that time the R9 was still being engineered and was months away from manufacture. My dealer and I both put in our orders then. it took more than 18 months (1 1/2 YEARS!) :P to finally get them, bit the gun isworth the wait! ;D
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>>Musician...
Just because the gun was a little late is no reason to BITE the poor thing. Yeah, yeah, I know - stupid joke. But like several other forum members today I am just sitting back being lazy. So WHY am I indoors on a computer on such a beautiful day...? Hmmmmm...TW<<
P.S... Forgot to say - CONGRATULATIONS on your "new" R9...! Don't forget to let us know how it tastes...I mean shoots...!
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Great!! I know Eric told me things were really beginning to pick up a pace so - here's hopin'!! :)
Pick up pace?
My dealer's order just slipped yet ANOTHER month! This is an order placed in October that NOW isn't going to be delivered until late June!
I may end up cancelling as my local dealer's shipping dates put the delivery date close to a 2000 mile move!
Hard to take delivery of a HANDGUN across the country...
ARGHH!
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This is not an insurmountable problem if your dealer will cooperate... When ready, if appropriate, the factory can ship it to an FFL in your new location.
Your dealer may be feeding you a line. I don't think the factory quotes shipping dates other than in the vaguest of generalities, so they don't have problems with people if production is slower than anticipated.
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This is not an insurmountable problem if your dealer will cooperate... When ready, if appropriate, the factory can ship it to an FFL in your new location.
Your dealer may be feeding you a line. I don't think the factory quotes shipping dates other than in the vaguest of generalities, so they don't have problems with people if production is slower than anticipated.
My dealer is NOT feeding me a line.... The ship date is slipppppinnnngggg away
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How do you know that? Has the factory quoted him a delivery date? The only reason I ask is that they normally don't do that. This is not a straight line production -- things go out in batches and only when they are right. I have known people to get very frustrated with the fact that the factory would not promise a delivery date even though the gun was delivered only a few days later. Its not their M.O.
Every since the factory shut down for the move, in particular, they have been VERY circumspect about any promises on delivery.
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Does anyone really have any idea when they will start shipping? I too have been waiting since October.. I will continue to wait but it would be nice to have an idea when to expect delivery.. I would rather know I am going to have to wait another month or two or three, then to think it will be anyday now.. The not knowing is worse part of waiting, just give me a clue, makes it easier to be patient.. :)
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If you have your order in you better keep it in. I would guess that the delivery times are going to be climbing to 10-12 months within the next few weeks. The R9 was written up in the American Rifleman and Maria asked Karl what was happening when he came in last Monday. The phones have been ringing off the hook. To top in all off Rohrbaugh was named gun of the year at the NRA show. Wait times are only going to get longer, not shorter. It might be worth trying to sell your order to someone else. It is done with Ferraris all the time. You order the gun, put the money up, then 5 months later you sell the gun that could be delivered in a month or two to someone who doesn't want to wait long for a premium.
It is difficult to find a Rohrbaugh in stock, especially in areas where guns are cheap. A dealer will not tie up that much money into an order for that long when he can turn a Glock for a 5% profit every month or 60% a year. He would have to jack the price through the roof to get that kind of return on money invested in a Rohrbaugh. If he uses your money, it doesn't matter.
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OK, I can not just sit here and let this get out of hand. New guys-patience is a virtue! The R9 is worth the wait. The Rohrbaugh folks are great and are not jacking anyone around. They have spent a lot of time and money to get the new larger plant going-in an effort to build and ship more guns. Since the new plant started building and finishing guns, they are trying to get a good picture of their production volume. They give us dealers the best time frame for shipping based on two things, when the order was placed and production volume to date. Not enough time has pasted to get a good grip on their production volume to give a exact date. I have been given a general date for shipment only to have something happen to delay it. Guns will be coming out in bunches until production smoothes out. Orders are handled on a first in, first shipped basis. The Rohrbaugh firm and folks are heads above others in this business and are working very hard to take orders in turn, build a quality gun and ship same as soon as possible in a honest and straight forward manner. WE as dealers and end user customers need to support their effort with our understanding and patience. Wild stories on what ifs & etc., do no one any good. Regards, Tom
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Jeff makes a good suggestion - but in the end - I'd say anyone can rest assured that they are not being given a hard time purposefully.
Waiting is a devil - always - but Chris - even if you are relocating, keep that order and just get shipping to a new local FFL. Easy for me to say stay patient but - do try and hang in there.
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Tom is correct that this process is being run, as best I can tell, with the utmost integrity. No one is jumping the line -- trust me, I tried! ;) Any delays in shipping are a result of guns not being finished on time for whatever reason--but its not lack of effort. Eric has told me stories of frames and various parts that have been rejected because they are not perfect. I don't think we want sub-standard or rushed guns. Good things come to those who wait. An 8 month wait will have been long forgotten when your R-9 has served you well for 20 years.
As far as I know, guns are shipping every week at volumes never before reached.
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My pistol will be delivered next week, I ordered in September. I just hope I keep up with this forum after I receive the R9, because I've truly enjoyed reading and leaving my comments. It's been fun. I guess I'll order a second pistol and . . .
ENJOY THE WAIT
Kerry
P.S. Where else can you meet famous people like R.J.!
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Hey all!
I ordered in August and was told today that I should expect shipment next week. I don't know how this relates to later orders. It sounds like a lot of guns should be going out the next couple of weeks.
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Fingers crossed for you (patient) guys! :)
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In talking with Eric, Rohrbaugh is working on a bunch of R9s to ship next week. So alot of those orders from August and Sept., will be going out.Oct will soon follow. Having said that, lets put this whole thing in prospective. S&W took over 18 months to come to market and ship their new 500. So, here is a company over 150 years old with "deep pockets" and it takes them a long time to ship! I think the Rohrbaugh bros., are doing a great job in getting the R9 designed, built,to market and shipped in as few months as it has been. As we look down the road we will all be laughing about paying our dues in getting the R9. A kid does not become a US Marine over night, it takes months! Lets all try to be patient as it builds character!!!!! regards, Tom
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>>How about we R9 owners/waiters all get a Rohrbaugh tattoo on our biceps with the number of months we waited to receive the guns tattooed underneath...? Just a thought to pass the time...TW<<
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That's an interesting idea, TW. According to my calculation, I might qualify for a tatoo reading "24." I placed my order shortly after the prototype R9 was shown at the 2002 Shot Show and took delivery in 2004.
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What a great idea, lets get an arist to draw up the tattoo, get the R bros., to sign off and we will all be proud R9 owners with the wait time under our sleeves not on them. What a hoot!!! Tom
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I would just like to repeat what us R9S owners already know for those who are waiting. THE WAIT WILL BE WELL WORTH IT! This pistol is the smallest 9mm POCKET gun in the world. It will make everyday carry a pleasure. You will sit on the couch at nite with it in your hand and marvel at its design & craftsmanship.You will not belive the accuracy from this little package.WAIT for it, I did and I don't regret it and now I have two, sorry. :-X :-/ :-* ;D
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I guess "churning out" is a matter of perspective. In the first few months of this board not more than a couple hundred guns shipped. Now I see them at gun shows and on the on-line auction services.
There are certainly plenty of guns being shipped -- unless several of us are being lied to by the factory. You can take my word for what its worth -- but the Rohrbaughs are nothing if not completly honest.
Please don't look for a conspiracy theory here. Its a simple fact of high demand and low supply. The manufacturing process is slow because of the methods employed and the higest levels of quality control.
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~~Delivery Dates~~
I hate projected dates, as soon as a date is given, it is assumed to be "chiseled in stone".
But, often unexpected things happen, this is life.
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Chris-S, For you as a newbie to state, that the factory is having problems and guns are NOT being shipped is WRONG!!! I don't think you know what you are saying, but just throwing comments out there. Its nice to know that you have this background and knowledge of the manufacturing business. I don't think its right for you to judge the Rohrbaughs as being dis-honest. They are doing their best to build quality guns in quantity. It might be good for you to go back and read all the old threads to get some sort of idea who and what the Rohrbaughs are. Then read about how the gun was designed and built. Then you might get a since of how quality the Rohrbaughs and their guns are. Tom
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Chris-S, For you as a newbie to state, that the factory is having problems and guns are NOT being shipped is WRONG!!! I don't think you know what you are saying, but just throwing comments out there. Its nice to know that you have this background and knowledge of the manufacturing business. I don't think its right for you to judge the Rohrbaughs as being dis-honest. They are doing their best to build quality guns in quantity. It might be good for you to go back and read all the old threads to get some sort of idea who and what the Rohrbaughs are. Then read about how the gun was designed and built. Then you might get a since of how quality the Rohrbaughs and their guns are. Tom
Wow, you sure read a lot into my post that I didn't say!
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Wow! I had no idea of the responses that this topic would create when I first posted it awhile back. Since then I have gotten a r9s. Let me say as most of you have said. The wait is worth it. I had to pay a big premium in order to get it a little early, but that is over and done with now. The factory is now starting to ship and you guys should be getting your guns soon. I was really starting to think about getting a Kahr pm9 and I am glad that I didn't. A friend of mine brought one to the range the other day and although it is a fine gun the quality is just not up to par with the r9. This is a true custom piece, how many factory guns offer carbon fiber grips? I have almost 200 flawless rnds through it. I have gotten more use from this gun in 2 months than any other gun that I own except for my IPSC pistol. This is a gun that I can carry all day long and not complain about the weght. I live in Florida and wear shorts most ot the year. Stick it out guys you won't be sorry.
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How do you know that? Has the factory quoted him a delivery date? The only reason I ask is that they normally don't do that. This is not a straight line production -- things go out in batches and only when they are right. I have known people to get very frustrated with the fact that the factory would not promise a delivery date even though the gun was delivered only a few days later. Its not their M.O.
Every since the factory shut down for the move, in particular, they have been VERY circumspect about any promises on delivery.
With all due respect, I am not "feeding anyone a Line".
I called Maria on Monday May 23rd and was told my delivery that had been scheduled for the end of April, then the end of May, is now the end of June due to a "Heat Treat Problem".
Call her yourself. Ask if that's what she told John Johnson from Performance Firearms in Brighton Michigan.
Don't Blame the Messenger.
As owner of a gage manufacturing shop I fully understand setbacks in deliveries caused by the inevitable need for outsourcing.
When my customers ask if I have heard any word on their deliveries, it is my obligation to be truthful with them.
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John, As a dealer myself, thats what I was told "heat treat" problem on bbls. This has moved back some shipments. Having said that, guns are going out next week, based on date ordered. First in first out. All of us waiting on guns lets try to settle down and give them a chance to ship in peace, and not raise hell about whats going on. Those of us that have been here awhile know that shipments will happen and the wait is worth it. There is no one to blame. For the new person please read old posts, which will show you that everything will be ok in the long run. Patience is like a badge to a Rohrbaugh customer. Please lets not throw out statements about this unless you know it to be the truth. Regards, Tom
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When I was a younger man, I hated to wait for anything. Ironically, the older I have become, the more patience I seem to have acquired. Logic might suggest that it would be the other way around. My experience, however, is that those things I most value in life are those for which I either worked the hardest or waited the longest.
I believe I first started to learn patience over the course of three hunting seasons in the Challis Wilderness of Idaho, during which I spent more time and money than I care to recall in pursuit of a certain mule deer buck whose rack now adorns the wall of my den.
Waiting for the R9s was essentially effortless. The reward for the patience was, and continues to be, well worth the limited time of waiting.
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Not to offend any dealers... I must be wrong on that.
I can't tell you how many people have complained to me that they could not get a promise of an anticipated delivery date. Eric has told me that he won't do that -- even when the guns are close -- so people aren't disappointed.
Obviously they either treat dealers differently or maybe Maria is running the show differently than Eric did.
Perhaps delivery dates are "slipping" -- but I am certain that is not for lack of trying on their part. This is Karl's lifelong dream come true and he has invested his (and others) fortunes in this project -- slow delivery of guns its part of the grand plan.
Sit tight -- the guns are coming.
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>>Actually, Duane... Eric did in fact project delivery of my #1 gun - TWICE...and neither came true...!!...lol. The third time he would only mention the projected delivery date by SEASON...and by golly he was right on the money...! I swear the guy is some kind of wizard...!...TW<<
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I can understand the anxiousness on the part of everyone who is waiting to receive one, (or more ;D), of these fine pieces.
To some, it may be a greater inconvenience than just the waiting, which inevitably would increase the anxiety level.
I, for one, prefer to have a product made right the first time, rather than have it made quickly and have to possibly return it later.
There are a lot of companys that might yield to the pressure to lower their standards "just a tad" to get more product shipped.
I'm glad Rohrbaugh Firearms is not one of them. ;)
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You said it perfectly, I would rather have it right than to have trouble later on. This is one gun that when you get it just shoot and put in your pocket. There is absolutely nothing else to do. There are no whiz bang dohickey's to add on. The company has got it right.
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Wow, this has been a very busy forum over the last couple of days.. :D
The reality is all of us waiting for our Rohrbaugh's will continue to wait, I think we just needed a place to vent.. :-X
Thanks for listening.. And keep telling us how good it will be once we get our own..
Tom.. :)
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Hi all, just wondering if anyone heard anything more on delivery dates?? I ordered mine late October, beginning of November, not sure when to anticipate delivery anymore.. Last I talked to my dealer he said my gun was on back order, but I could have told him that..
Any news would be appreciated.. Thanks for your help.. and yes I know patience is a virtue.. Tom.. :)
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Tom,
My dealer (Performance Firearms) in Michigan placed his order in October 2004.
He talked with Maria recently, and Maria said the shipment could be expected at the end of June, or the first or second week in July.
Bill