The Rohrbaugh Forum
Rohrbaugh Products and Accessories => Rohrbaugh R9 (all variations) => Topic started by: sebis on October 07, 2006, 03:13:06 PM
-
Went to the range for the third time with R9S. I used only Super Lube grease on the slide and oil as directed, no Militech.
The first two magazines of GD 115gr. went flawless then at the third and fourth magazine the 5th round would get stuck on the ramp and had to push it in.
I recognize after the second magazine I was feeling fatigue in the shooting hand (I shot some 50 rounds in my HK in the meanwhile) and had trouble dealing with the recoil by then. However, being always the 5th round makes me believe is something else then my grip.
What do you guys think?
Note to self: need to find some sort of exercise for my hand to deal better with the recoil.
--Sebis
-
I have yet to discover a real explanation for the (enter number here) round would not feed right.
I am tho - at risk of a butt kicking from Eric ;) - more and more of the opinion that after some use with grease lube on slide, the slide velocity can be marginally slowed - this happened to my 226 SIG. Thus I only use Militech1 for slide/frame lube - or even Mobil1 would do.
Thing is I will disassemble, clean and lube even more often so this does not prejudice my gun - but IMO it does aid function - grease goes on all the other recommended points.
As for grip - well for sure the pup does punish a bit and perhaps some tennis ball squeezing excercizes would not go amiss. That said, I think grip has to be pretty soggy before limp wristing is a problem. Thing is while we all (hopefully) have two hands - grip methods, strength and hand sizes do vary a lot. Hard therefore to really assess without seeing.
I regularly wish anyone with problems could join me at the range for a diagnostic session - which is not to say I am expert on the R9 - but I sure am intrigued sometimes when I read of problems and want to get my hands on the troublesome gun!
I doubt I have had a chance to say welcome yet - welcome :)
-
I doubt I have had a chance to say welcome yet - welcome :)
Thank you for the welcome, I red your FAQ and I am still searching for the best lube technique for my R9.
I tried Militech the last time but I made a mistake and added too much gun oil on top of it that and went all on my hands after the first magazine. I guess I'll go back to a combination of Militech and Super Lube and try again.
If this still doesn't work I may need to look for different ammo. I am thinking that a round that is closer in shape to ball would work better in my R9 since all the problems are with getting stuck on the ramp with the bullet cavity enclosing the bottom of the feed ramp, I hope I described clear enough.
--Sebis
-
Scanning the board I came up with this two options:
Winchester Super-X Ammunition 9mm Luger 115 Grain Silvertip Hollow Point Box of 50 = $27.99 @ MidwayUSA
or
Federal Personal Defense Ammunition 9mm Luger 115 Grain Jacketed Hollow Point Box of 20 (Hi-Shok) = 12.29 @ MidwayUSA.
I will try them both next time. Form an engineering perspective, which one do you think is better?
--Sebis
-
Groo here
I have gotten away from any oil on my R9
I use superlube in the recomended places and a small amount on the action triger etc oil only if I take the grips off " one drop."
After the break in one spring or less. 200 rds.
I shoot about 2 or 3 mags then something else,
go home clean ,lube and put in my holster.
With greese in the gun dirt and lint cant get in.
-
Sebis,
I tested the Federal Hi Shok 115 Gr. JHP with no jams in 3 magazines.
-
Ed Zackly!
is same problem I have had with my r9s.
hangs up right on lower edge of ramp..in my case it jams up
so tight I have to hold the slide open and force the magazine out with my thumb...the company (today) suggested it was a burr on the feed ramp...I am a little dubious of this...but they did offer for me to ship it back to them with a note explaining my problem...
in my case the pistol WILL feed FMJ 115 grain...but hollow points are all stop. and, for defensive purposes I'd prefer it to handle JHP well enough to feel confident in the thing (that is 100%!) before I lay my 380 and my 38 aside for it. I am going to the range with mine one more time and then if still not good it is off to rohrbaugh and I will advise of the result ..as noted by me elsewhere on this site today the young lady you speak to at Rohrbaugh could not be much more polite or helpful for her part...give her a call. Maybe if several of us report the same problem we'll get a recall..maybe it will rain hundred dollar bils!
-
I found some Silvertips locally, will try this next. If I still can't get 4 magazines without a jam with the Silvertips, the gun is going back to Rorhbaugh for warranty work.
I am a little disappointed at this point for several reasons. The Stealth finish is not as good looking as my HK P2000SK, it came it a small blemish on the front sight and a scratch on the front of the slide.
At the end of the day the cosmetic issues would not bother me if it was reliable. My HK had couple of minor scratches on the frame from shipping but I forgot about those after the first trip to the range, that sucker would feed anything without a hiccup from day one and I shot in excess of 700 rounds thru it. If only HK would make a single stack polimer... dreams.
I do recognize Rohrbaugh thou for their endeavor, the smallest 9 mm in the World. I carried in my front pocket at the office and no one gave it a second look! If can only fix the feeding issues and I am set.
--Sebis
-
I think the Rohrbaugh Bros. are in the process of officially moving away from their recommendation of using grease to lube the R9 because of its tendancy to attract and hold grit and burnt powder residue, etc., which could possibly affect functioning.
-
I found some Silvertips locally, will try this next. If I still can't get 4 magazines without a jam with the Silvertips, the gun is going back to Rorhbaugh for warranty work.
Finally, I appears that my R9S is cured, I run 4 magazines of Silvertips and one magazine of GS 115 gr. without a hiccup. I think mine is now finally broken in after 100 rounds.
I think I like the Silvertips, I felt less recoil then Gold Dots. I am making the Silvertips my carry ammo for the Rohrbaugh.
--Sebis
-
Good news Sebis :)
-
Finally, I appears that my R9S is cured, I run 4 magazines of Silvertips and one magazine of GS 115 gr. without a hiccup. I think mine is now finally broken in after 100 rounds.
I think I like the Silvertips, I felt less recoil then Gold Dots. I am making the Silvertips my carry ammo for the Rohrbaugh.
--Sebis
Sebis,
Excellent!!
I go back and forth on the 115 GDs and 115 STHPs..
I am with you though,the GDs "bark" a bit more IMO..
Hope the pup continues to feed well for you..
Brenden
-
Sebis, glad your R9 is working smooth. Find the ammo it likes and stick with it. Dan
-
Hey guys, i am sure i am going to ruffle some feathers with my comments because i know we all love these guns. I have only had mine to the range 3 times and it has improved immensely from the first time. However, i feel that we all seem to be making excuses for the short comings of this gun. If i bought a $250 or $300 kel-tec, then i would expect to have problems and have to find "just" the right ammo that it likes. And worry about it heating and having "just" the right amount of the right oil, etc. However, when i pay $1000 for a gun, i think it should shoot ever time I pull the trigger and it should fire any quality ammo I feed it. I don't have a problem with frequent cleaning. Any piece of machinery works better if you properly maintain it. I do think there is something wrong when you have to go searching for some ammo that this gun likes. A high dollar gun like this should go "bang" everytime you pull the trigger. You should never have to worry if you have "just" the right ammo, Again, i know i am not going to make a lot of friends with these comments but this is what i think. I still love my gun and i don't have any thoughts about giving it up. I love the way it looks, the way it feels and i love being able to carry a 9mm in my pocket. But i am a little concerned about the reliability. Ron C
-
Ron,
I don't want to ruffle your feathers but yours seems like an
idle complaint; if you don't have a problem, what is your
problem? We don't, as you suggest, "all make excuses".
I, for one, and I think I am in the majority do not have any
complaints. The R-9 has more than met my expectations.
There have been a few problems but most have been resolved.
Just because something is high dollar does not guarantee
that it is problem free as some exotic car owners have had
to admit. A self defense weapon, of course, is a different
animal than an automobile, but I do not hesitate to pack the
pup.
-
Ronc, All Rohrbaugh has to do is make the gun bigger. Then it will go bang every time with every kind of ammo. ;D This is a precision machine milled to the .0001 and as such there are some hiccups till you get it right. Dan
-
And thats an answer that will inspire confidence! :D
-
Confidence is what I have with my pup!! :)
I would not carry it otherwise..
I have many other guns that are reliable too,of the same caliber,but I can't fit the dudes in my pocket!! ;)
I love the Seecamp,but it is not a 9mm,I carry it on "offside" pocket when I feel the "need" .380 or the .32..
The pup is a constant companion,and has been more than reliable for me!! 8)
Brenden
-
Ron C,
I think I understand what you are trying to say and I have to say that I pretty much agree with you. But remember, after you find just the right ammo it will be 100% reliable. Both mine are but ONLY with specific ammo. I guess I must be holding mine wrong. ::)
Mike
-
This pic is in one of my test reports - #3 - and have posted it before.
My take is this - despite ''to spec'' being applied to factory ammo - we have tolerances as with anything. Compare these few examples and we see difference OAL's and ogive radii etc - and with the pup it is perforce a bit fussy.
Large 9mm's will be flexible in what they eat - most anything but the pup does require the finding of what works best. Whether that is the same for all of us or not - and seems not - it is still IMO the way to find what suits your R9.
I have said before and repeat again - the gun is cutting edge for size vs cal and needs 100 octane fuel rather than good ol 87 regular :D
(http://www.acbsystems.com/boards/thr/r9s-tests-03/images/ammo-01b-s.jpg)
-
okay, i knew i would tick some of you off with my original comments. Let me apologize just a bit. I will make two comments here in reponse to what has been posted in reponse to my comment. First, to continue with the analogy of the exotic car: i have had a couple of semi-exotic cars and yes they require high maintenance but you don't have to go around looking for a "Shell" station because you can't feed it Exxon or Amoco (smile). It will run on any premium fuel. Now before i get a storm of hate mail from this comment, let me respond to another comment posted. Someone made a simple statement that all Rohrbaugh had to do is make the gun bigger and it would not be tempermental. That hit home with me and i expect this is a true statement. so, I agree that you have to give up something to get a gun that is this small and still shoots "big boy" size ammo. So, as simple as that was, it makes a difference to me. Yes, if i was trying to fit a 427" engine in a Honda, i expect it would take a lot of Thinking and it would probably be a bit tempermental. So, i withdraw my original comment and wish you all a good day. Ron C
-
Ron, It sounds like you had a slight case of buyer's remorse
and were just looking for some warm, fuzzy reasons to own
the pup--nothing wrong with that.
-
Hello All,
No, I will expand on Ron C's posts. The last I have heard there were still no ammo recomendations in the owners manual.
And as was said earlier, for a 1K handgun is should be expected to function perfectly with the recomended ammo which of course the manual does not mention so any even slightly educated gun owner must conclude that practically any ammo will function.
Men, whether you want to admit it or not, and I don't care about any other manufacturers previous guns in their early periods and the problems that those guns had, etc., etc., etc.. The Rohrbaugh R9 has some issues. Now if the R bros. can remedy these issues immediately and all further production guns are reliable then Rohrbaugh will be selling R9's AND moveing to larger production facalities maybe 2 or 3 more times AND introducing new products etc., etc,. If not then they will remain a small company with limited distribution of their products.
Unlike Ron C. I do not retract my posts. These are my opinions and I don't care if some people do not like it. This post is not intended to provoke or rile or p*** anyone off. I have read most posts on the board. I am familiar with what the R9 is all about, that is why I own 2 of them. Most average shooters in the U.S. will not put up with some of the problems that SOME have had with the R9. Those people will think their gun is a jam O matic and sell it soon after buying it and from then on they will convey a negative perspective of the R9 to anyone they do gun talk with.
Well, I have rambled on enough. I mean everything I wrote in this post. If you wish to disagree, no problem. But I won't back off as easily as Ron C. did.
I love my R9's, Mike
-
Ron C,
I think I understand what you are trying to say and I have to say that I pretty much agree with you. But remember, after you find just the right ammo it will be 100% reliable. Both mine are but ONLY with specific ammo. I guess I must be holding mine wrong. ::)
Mike
:DHold it like ya mean it! ;D
-
Speaking of holding, I think I'm going to hold on to my $1k until some reliability changes are made to the R9 at the factory.
From the reading I've done, it still seems pot-luck as to whether you'll get a shooter.
I have neither the time nor money to go through 8+ different types of ammo, seeing which one the R9 will work with, in addition to paying for return shipping on a brand new gun back to the facotry.
The fact that many NEW R9's require trip(s) back to the shop is unacceptable IMHO.
It seems to me that there's really no motivation to make the R9 more ammo friendly since people are still tripping over each other to order one.
If it requires adding 0.05" here & 0.1" there, so be it, just git-r-done as I'd REALLY like to order one soon!
-
TXAGGIECHL,
Since I have 2 R9's and have already done all the ammo research I can give you 3 types that I would be willing to guarantee will function in any R9 you acquire. You won't have to do anything at all except maybe order the ammo online if it is not available at your local. I have posted the ammo types previously in another thread. Even with the difficulties that I have had I like mine. They are sweeeeet handguns.
Mike
-
I wanted to follow up on my initial post, since I went pass the 100 rounds mark, I DID NOT have another failure with my R9S. I did settle on the 115 gr Silvertips as carry ammo.
--Sebis
-
Finally, I appears that my R9S is cured, I run 4 magazines of Silvertips and one magazine of GS 115 gr. without a hiccup. I think mine is now finally broken in after 100 rounds.
I think I like the Silvertips, I felt less recoil then Gold Dots. I am making the Silvertips my carry ammo for the Rohrbaugh.
--Sebis
Oh, great! Now I have 900 rounds of GDHP and a 10,000 year supply of Super Lube. Sheesh!
Hello everyone! I noticed nobody noticed my absence. I'm the kind of guy, who, when he walks into a room, it's like someone important just left;^)
Many of my exploits keep me away from the list (guitars for one thing, but I'm not going there on this list again;^) Also, the biz is keeping me, um, bizzy. And all the campaigning is taking it's toll;^)
BTW-those of us who DO like to talk about guitars can go to The Gear Page <thegearpage.net/board/> Lot's of nice people there, too!
I hope ya'll have been well. I miss this place. I need more time to read!
Calvin Cooledge
"Vote for me; The other guy's worse..."
-
Calvin Cooledge,
Welcome back. I'm sort of an invisible man myself. Sometimes that's a good thing. ;)
I've got only 200 rounds of GDHP ammo to get rid of.....and a lifetime supply of SuperLube. :'(
I just got off the phone with Maria at Rohrbaugh because there's a lot of information in other threads about lubrication, recoil springs, grip screws, etc. A lot of that information is wrong.
FWIW: Maria said that anyone with questions should call her directly and she'll answer them or get the answer if she doesn't know.
Ammo: Karl R. carries Winchester Silvertips. (So do I, as they've been 100% reliable. I started having feed problems with GDHP @ about 250 rounds.)
Grease: Rohrbaugh is now using the Hornady lube because he found a lot of the returned guns had too much Superlube grease. But if you are satisfied with SuperLube, there is no reason to switch. (I've switched to Brian Enos' SLIDE GLIDE and feel it works better than SuperLube. It was designed specifically for 1911 guns. I've been using it for a few years on my other autoloaders.)
Oil: Any good quality gun oil is fine. Rohrbaugh has stopped recommending Mobil 1 because the grade originally suggested is no longer offered. (I have a quart - enough for 500 years.)
Recoil Spring: The recommendation is still 200-250 rounds before changing spring. There has NOT been a spec change on the spring. Rohrbaugh doesn't recommend changing the guide rod assy as a normal maintenance item.
Grip Screws: They have NOT gone to a harder screw. About 4 weeks ago they got a new batch of screws in that take a 1.5 mm allen wrench instead of 1/16". Rather than hold up shipment of finished guns to dealers, Rohrbaugh decided to ship guns with the metric hex screws and send replacement screws to new owners when they get a batch of 1/6" hex screws in. This was a supplier goof and it takes a little time to get new stock set up & run off. When they turn the screw making machine, they make thousands of the little buggers.
-
Would it make a difference if Rohrbaugh came out and said it takes a 100 or 200 hundred round "break in period"?
Would our expectations be different?
-
it sure would have made me feel better. I pulled mine out of the box at a dealer that had an indoor range and took it into the range and loaded it. The first or 2nd round jamed the gun. There were multible failures to fire and eject. I was kind of disappointed. However by the 2nd trip it did considerably better and by the 3rd trip, there were no failures to fire or eject. There was that little trigger problem that i have mentioned before. Have not had a chance to get back and see if that will happen again. Ron C