The Rohrbaugh Forum

Miscellaneous => The Water Cooler -- General Discussions => Topic started by: Aglifter on November 17, 2005, 12:57:08 AM

Title: 08 elections
Post by: Aglifter on November 17, 2005, 12:57:08 AM
Just some ramblings...who the heck is there to vote for?  I refuse to consider a nation under the control of Billary (or any democrat after ~1900 for that matter) -- and, as much as I hate to say this, GW, even though he's from Texas, has not been as much of a political conservative as I would have liked -- which gives me some pause about Rice... anyone have a suggestion?  What I really want is another TR, or at least someone with his level of guts
Title: Re: 08 elections
Post by: RJ HEDLEY on November 17, 2005, 07:15:59 AM
I totally agree, but the President is not the only one that has a need for ''GUTS''.
This Nation has really taken a turn for the worse with all this Political Correctness  B---S---..

This is not the most polished way to express this, but you get my drift  ;D
Title: Re: 08 elections
Post by: sslater on November 17, 2005, 02:08:28 PM
With today's political climate, the really good people won't run!  You have to be a megalomaniac, or crazy, or both to get into national politics these days.  

About the only thing we poor average citizens can do is let our congressmen & senators know we are sick of the partisan sniping and we will vote against the ones behind the game-playing.  Tom Dashele (sp?) found out the hard way.  We need more of that kind of "signaling" to people on both sides of the aisle.

In the meantime, we are in a war and the political left acts like it's business as usual.  Disgusting!  >:(

BTW:  Compared to what I've read of 19th century politicians, today's pols are pussycats.

Steve S.
Title: Re: 08 elections
Post by: theirishguard on November 17, 2005, 06:18:15 PM
The left are nothing but socialists, pure and simple. They will lie and do what ever it takes to get back into power.
George W is so hated because he has guts and stays the course and is effective. They refer to him as a cowboy, I think that is compliment.
The left don't care about US or the country any more, just power.
Title: Re: 08 elections
Post by: tracker on November 17, 2005, 06:41:36 PM
Stop beating around the bush and tell us how you really
about those limp-wristed, rug-hooking, loser-loving liberals.
Title: Re: 08 elections
Post by: theirishguard on November 17, 2005, 07:00:04 PM
tracker, I think you said it all.
Title: Re: 08 elections
Post by: Richard S on November 17, 2005, 07:42:58 PM
As a transplanted "Okie" now hanging his hat in Tennessee, I thank the Lord for the "cowboys" of the world!  As for my opinion of our President's performance in general, and in the War on Terror in particular, I'm reminded of a line from Garth Brooks' new single -- "Good ride, Cowboy, good ride!"  

Title: Re: 08 elections
Post by: sslater on November 17, 2005, 08:11:42 PM
I have to put two more cents in!  ;)
The left and the right are both all about power.
The only difference I see in my cynical old age:
The Left wants to run our lives because they're so smart and can do it better than we can.  All they ask is we turn off our minds and turn over our wallets.
The Right wants to tell us when life starts and when it can end because they're right.  (Pun intended.)

Steve S.
Title:  Re: 08 elections
Post by: RJ HEDLEY on November 17, 2005, 08:21:09 PM

Oh, my word, the man said "limp wristed"  :o

Title: Re: 08 elections
Post by: Richard S on November 17, 2005, 08:26:05 PM

Yes, but he graciously refrained from using "hot-house," or "knee-jerk," or "candy-cane," or . . . .    ;)
Title: Re: 08 elections
Post by: R9SCarry on November 17, 2005, 10:40:39 PM
I have this problem -

Shall I vote for Beelzebub - with the four point horns ..........

Or Lucifer, with the moose horns ...........

Sometimes diabolical seems to cover most or all choices - compared with what I might actually choose!!

At my age - politicians = cynicism - not sure why! :P ::) ;D
Title: Re: 08 elections
Post by: sslater on November 18, 2005, 12:15:07 AM
At my age - politicians = cynicism - not sure why!    

Experience..... 8)
Title: Re: 08 elections
Post by: Richard S on November 18, 2005, 12:21:32 PM
I like the following comment attributed to Texas State Representative Suzanna Hupp (R - District 54), a recipient of the NRA's Sybil Ludington Women's Freedom Award:

"How a politician stands on the Second Amendment tells you how he or she views you as an individual ... as a trustworthy and productive citizen, or as part of an unruly crowd that needs to be lorded over, controlled, supervised, and taken care of."
Title: Re: 08 elections
Post by: Gramps on November 18, 2005, 01:23:22 PM
   You should try and be a Union Worker and a Republican supporter. You find all kinds of "presents" in your lunch bucket or on/in your vehicle. You learn to check/watch overhead when you're working. You avoid the Porta-Johns when you can, and you learn to duck fast and come out of the duck, swinging your fists.  IronWorkers and Pipefitters have been the worst opponents. Once they find out you support a Republican they work as hard as they can to make your working life miserable. Nothing is out of bounds for a Republican supporter as far as they're concerned. This includes defecating  and urinating in your tool box or lunch bucket.
   I made the mistake of speaking out against Kerry at a Union meeting (I know, not real bright to do on my part). I wasn't sent out on any work for 6 months and my supplemental pay kept getting mysteriously "delayed". It was "delayed" for 5 months.
   There was a fund raiser recently for a person whom wants to run as a Democrate for governor of our state. I refused to contribute because of that persons stance on guns, gun ownership, and concealed carry. Now I all of sudden there seems to be a "problem" with my disability benefits (I'm temporarily out due to a large amount of hip and spinal surgury) from my union local.
    Now I will say one thing flat out. I am not happy at all with the Republican I helped vote in as our Govenor, nor am I happy with the way the Republicans I help vote into our state congress are acting. They've cut medical and health care for lower income people in my state drastically, while at the same time voting in a pay raise and better health care benefits for themselves. Except for pushing CCW through in my state, they've done nothing else for us gun owners that pushed so hard to get them their elected seats. The Republican govenor has been "handing" (no bids) too many of his high dollar supporters, state contracts. Frankly he has become a "one term" govenor as for as I'm concerned. It leaves me in the dilema of who to support and vote for. I may start seriously looking at Independants at the next elections.

Title: Re: 08 elections
Post by: Aglifter on November 18, 2005, 01:32:20 PM
Sounds like you're in PA... The last time I was up there, I suggested draggin evey politician out into the street... figured 1 or 2 might be innocent.  Scary part is that my grandmother -- who worked in Congress for 20 years agreed w. me  (In all fairness, her rep.  Bob Walker, really was one of the few good guys in DC)
Title: Re: 08 elections
Post by: theirishguard on November 18, 2005, 02:24:33 PM
RichardS, enough said!!!! ::)
Title: Re: 08 elections
Post by: Newt on November 20, 2005, 10:32:02 AM
Lets keep our eye on the Congress! We need to keep Republicans in charge of it no matter what happens to the Presidencey. :-X
Title: Re: 08 elections
Post by: theirishguard on November 20, 2005, 11:03:04 AM
Newt, I agree, but lets not give up on the President.
Title: Re: 08 elections
Post by: Newt on November 20, 2005, 06:00:15 PM
I won't give up Tom but I'm afraid that after a two term Republican president the sometimes crazy electorate will make a change " just because", after all we are in the age of the absence of common sense. It is,IMO, critical to keep control of the House and Senate. :P :-/ :D
Title: Re: 08 elections
Post by: theirishguard on November 20, 2005, 07:56:00 PM
If the wicked witch of NY gets in we are all in trouble, and I mean all of us. We need another swift boat crew.... like the Ark State Police & etc.

Title: Re: 08 elections
Post by: RJ HEDLEY on November 21, 2005, 01:28:52 PM

I can relate to your post on Unions,  I was in plenty of Union controled shops..   I always asked these *Union guys*,  "How would you like to have the Union Organizers show up at the door of your place of business?"  

''PC'' comments expected.
Title: Re: 08 elections
Post by: Gramps on November 22, 2005, 03:21:38 PM
   Well, to tell you the truth. I brought my small company into the  IBEW Local union by choice. My shop wasn't organized. I had been a small electrical contractor for almost 10 years when I decided to join and called them up. I had been hiring men off the street for years, all of them with book smarts, but most of them had no "work" smarts. The quality of work I could get from them was not the craftsmenship I was looking for. There didn't seem to any emphasise on work "quality" at any of the trade schools they had attended. When I signed up the Local took the two youngest men that worked for me, and placed them in the apprenticeship program; the remainder were required to take wireman night courses at the apprentice school, twice a week for a year. The courses were paid for by the Local but on the mens time. The men were then given the Journeyman Wiremans exam after one year. If they passed they received an "A" card and were classified as Journeymen. The one man that didn't pass the exam had to attend review classes until the next testing period. He passed that exam and was given his "A" card.
   The wage scale was close to what I was already paying but benefits were higher, to me it was well worth it. I have no complaints about the IBEW Local workers at all. The men that I pulled out of the hiring hall were good mechanics, they gave me a good days work and with craftsmen quality in the installation. I had a heart attack later on and the Local did it's best to help me stay in business. It sent a man to run my work while I was in the hospital and other union shops sent me small jobs to keep things going for me while I healed. When I finally closed my shop down it was no fault of the union. All of my remaining men were given work at other shops. I was given work at a medium sized shop, were I was a foreman for 4 years, until I quit that shop.
   My problems are with the present administration of the Local. They managed to get themselves elected into place by an extremely small majority and have managed to stay in office with that small majority. They are hard core Democrats, straight party supporters and voters on all issues. They dislike the NRA immencely; though many of the wiremen in the Local are NRA Life members. I have to admit I also haven't done anything to endear myself to them. I've worked for and supported union members that have run against them in the past two elections.
  I personally vote for who I think will represent me better on issues I beleave in. That may be a Republican, a Democrat, or an Independent. When they do not do as they say they will; I work to vote them out of office. If they work and do as I like , I work hard and support them to keep them in office. We had a Democratic State Senator that I voted for and supported for many years. He was extremely pro 2nd Admenedment, more so than many Republicans. He retired and we lost a doggone good man to represent us on firearm issues.
   I also know of several Republican workers that do the same things, that have been done to me, to Liberals that they work with or around. It isn't just a one party thing going on.

Title: Re: 08 elections
Post by: RJ HEDLEY on November 22, 2005, 05:59:04 PM
I can't remember even one good experience with a Union. I worked all over the U.S.for 15 years, as a Field Installation Engineer.  We always used Local Contractors and the ''Bid process'' to man the jobs.
 I've had more than a few site visits from the local BA's in several States, trying to tell me how many men to hire and other  attempts of coercion.  Apparently just bluffs, attempting to gain control of the job. I learned very fast, just  how they worked , and gathered a few methods to push back with.  
 Although I never had any action taken against me or the Companies I represented , I feel lucky to be alive today.

I'm sure there are some fair minded union people out there, it's just that I have never met many.
Title: Re: 08 elections
Post by: Gramps on November 22, 2005, 08:21:08 PM
   I've worked 24 years in open shops and 15 years in union shops. I've had my own business and worked for others. I been lucky enough to have seen the good and bad on both sides. There are many union people that are good, honest, hard working people. They do beleave in and support their unions though. Then again along with the good, you have the bad.
    The union business agents primary job is to get his members work. Some of them can be real rectums doing it. I had many a run in with them when I was open shop, most of them unpleasent. But I understood that they were doing what they were elected and payed to do. Like you, I learned to work around them.
    I also have several aquaintences that have businesses. After watching how some of them treated their employees, I could understand how a couple of them ended up being organized by unions. Let's face it, if you mistreat or cheat your employees you run the risk of them banding together against you. It is their legal right to do so.
   If you were dealing with the Pipefitters, Operating Engineers, IronWorkers, or ANY union official from NYC I can well understand your fearing for your life. I had a run in with a fella representing a large union in NYC once. He told me it would be in my best interest to leave for home that day. From the look on his face and from what local workers warned me, I decided leaving was the best choice. I packed my tools up and headed back to the midwest that afternoon. It may be judged cowardly, but I figured I was better off at home unemployeed than part of a trash landfill in New Jersey.
  Except for the present administration, I do feel that the IBEW Local here has given me more than a fair shake as an employeer and an employee. Just my opinion...and opinions are like belly buttons, we all have them. ;D


PS. Did you happen to receive my holster order yet? :D

Title: Re: 08 elections
Post by: tracker on November 22, 2005, 10:22:56 PM
IMHO, unions are like politics, the stock market, and
anything else that is structured where emotions and
psychology come into play--eventually, even though it
may take many years, everything reverts to the mean
and is self correcting; no extra charge for this observation.
Title: Re: 08 elections
Post by: RJ HEDLEY on November 22, 2005, 10:24:00 PM

The "BOYS" could get scary at times,  they do play Mind Games.. Once In Little Rock, I was butting heads with the Pipe Fitters Steward on a daily basis.
 One morning, I came out of my Motel room, got in the car, it was filthy, as it was the rainy seaon there.  Just as I was turning the key to start the car, I had a memory flash of two clean spot on the leading edge of the hood,  someone had been under the hood !!   Well, I got off off the key before, the starter engaged,  did a thorogh search all under every thing, found nothing.  The thought that I might have found something that goes BOOM, had been planted in my mind..

I see you are from Missouri, ...  St Louis is one place I refused to work a job,   it was the worst place to work *Union* at the time..    The "BOYS" can play rough at times...
Title: Re: 08 elections
Post by: Gramps on November 22, 2005, 11:29:47 PM
   St.Louis is a strong union city, but you can still get by. I worked open shop there for 16 years. Sometimes they don't just play mind games, they do things. Fella I lived next door to for a couple of years was a "thumper" for the fitters. Was sent to prison for a few years. His wife received a "pay check" every week until he was released. I live away from the city, don't like it or the politics there. When I moved out here 36 years ago this area was country. Now it's suburb.

Title: Re: 08 elections
Post by: RJ HEDLEY on November 23, 2005, 11:01:11 AM
''Sometimes they don't just play mind games, they do things. ''    Gramps

Yes, that is what makes the *GAMES* work,  You never know when it may be for 'REAL'.

One of their 'Mind Game Stories' told to me was of a 'Factory Ref', much like myself, would not Play Ball, so they prepared a TRICK,   On the job there was a big Culvert used as a passage way.  A temporary cover was welded on one end and another was prepared for the other end.  The Factory guy went in to inspect and the second end was rapidly closed.  

The story goes, he spent a few hours there..