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Author Topic: We are no longer the smallest 9 mm ??  (Read 17790 times)

Offline WatchTimes

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We are no longer the smallest 9 mm ??
« on: February 10, 2006, 12:31:37 AM »
http://kel-tec.com/pf9pr.htm



Hmm
Looks like Kel Tec is jumping on the bandwagon.
I had the .380 and the quality was just so lets say cheap, I dont know if I really trust them.  I will still have to take a look at this when it comes out.
« Last Edit: February 10, 2006, 12:31:59 AM by JYogi »
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Offline pocketgun

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Re: We are no longer the smallest 9 mm ??
« Reply #1 on: February 10, 2006, 01:37:17 AM »
I handled and even dry-fired it a the SHOT show today.  It was the nicest quality KT I have seen - admittedly, I am a KT fan however.  If you are looking for the finish level of an R9, you are probably not going to be satisfied.  I liked the PF-9 quite a bit, and compare it closely to a Kahr PM9.  It is thin and light, but longer and taller through the grips than both the PM9 and R9.  
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Offline FireBreather01

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Re: We are no longer the smallest 9 mm ??
« Reply #2 on: February 10, 2006, 01:44:46 AM »
The R9 is still smaller -

R9 5.2"l, 3.7"h, .812"w - 12.8 oz
PF9 5.85"l, 4.3"h, .88"w - 12.7 oz

and, dare I say - much better engineered and constructed! And WTF do you need/want an accessory rail for on a pocket gun????????????
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Offline R9SCarry

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Re: We are no longer the smallest 9 mm ??
« Reply #3 on: February 10, 2006, 01:55:26 AM »
Yep - that accessory rail really got to me! ;D

I agree this gun will prove to be some competition for the R9 - but then too we are apples and oranges as well!!

The price will filter out the buyers - and daresay the new KT will fit a niche - those folks who cannot or will not pay the R9 price.

Simple ! :)  I know which I prefer.
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Offline pocketgun

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Re: We are no longer the smallest 9 mm ??
« Reply #4 on: February 10, 2006, 02:00:39 AM »
I don't think it will really compete with the R9.  It is a bit thinner, especially through the grips, but otherwise larger.  

Karl R. took one of the new R9's apart for me today, and showed me the brand new Smith & Wesson M&P finishes.  The R9 is a one very fine pistol.  The triggers i tried today were much, much better than the one I tried at a gunshow several months back.  I now suspect that one may have had a problem.
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Offline jarcher

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Re: We are no longer the smallest 9 mm ??
« Reply #5 on: February 10, 2006, 02:29:39 AM »
Quote
The triggers i tried today were much, much better than the one I tried at a gunshow several months back.  I now suspect that one may have had a problem.

The triggers were better?  In what way?  
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Offline Fud

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Re: We are no longer the smallest 9 mm ??
« Reply #6 on: February 10, 2006, 02:44:11 AM »
The trigger on my R9 from about a year and a half ago is/was just fine. I hope they didn't change that.
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Offline pocketgun

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Re: We are no longer the smallest 9 mm ??
« Reply #7 on: February 10, 2006, 02:52:47 AM »
Quote

The triggers were better?  In what way?  

The one I tried originally was too heavy for my tastes and hung before it broke.  All the R9/R9s I dry-fired today were lighter and smoother, especially right before the break.
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Offline theirishguard

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Re: We are no longer the smallest 9 mm ??
« Reply #8 on: February 10, 2006, 12:07:03 PM »
Hey pocketgun, thanks for the info, look out you might have to get one now that you like it.
Tom
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Offline DDGator

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Re: We are no longer the smallest 9 mm ??
« Reply #9 on: February 10, 2006, 12:25:07 PM »
Kel-Tec was careful to say lightest and flattest... not smallest.

I think the R-9 specs were clearly a production goal, since the unloaded weight is .1 oz. less than a Rohrbaugh and the slide is hundreds of an inch ... er ... "flatter."

Frankly, I think KT has had something stuck in their craw ever since the R-9 and PM-9 took away their "smallest 9mm" advertising schtick.

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Offline Aglifter

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Re: We are no longer the smallest 9 mm ??
« Reply #10 on: February 10, 2006, 01:28:38 PM »
The trigger mechanism on the R9 is very simple -- I took my grip off, took the assembly apart and cleaned it, and had my wonderful original trigger again -- some lint/grit, etc had gotten into the grease.
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Offline R9SCarry

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Re: We are no longer the smallest 9 mm ??
« Reply #11 on: February 10, 2006, 03:54:57 PM »
The R9 trigger is indeed simple - to the point of being exquisitely so IMO.

Well, if Pocketgun tried the new and found them better - I have to wonder what ''better'' does to ''already superb''!!!!

My two are exact 7#, no problems with the break and butter smooth - hard to imagine that getting much better!  I actually find poundage no prob' with triggers but I do demand smooth.

I shall hope to get my sweaty paws on a new one sometime, just to see properly the small differences.
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Offline DTM_39

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Re: We are no longer the smallest 9 mm ??
« Reply #12 on: February 10, 2006, 04:31:38 PM »
I'm confused, But thats not hard to do. If the pf9 is .88"w and the r9 is .812"w How is the pf9 flatter?  Dan
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Offline FireBreather01

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Re: We are no longer the smallest 9 mm ??
« Reply #13 on: February 10, 2006, 04:48:21 PM »
I think the portion that actually contributes to the PF9 being wider are the slide and mag releases - the slide itself may be a bit thinner than the R9, but as a whole, with controls, the PF9 is wider.
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Offline sslater

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Re: We are no longer the smallest 9 mm ??
« Reply #14 on: February 10, 2006, 05:21:46 PM »
I sure like the trigger on my July 2005-built R9S.  IMHO, as good a DAO trigger as there is in the business.  The big trick is straight linkage without bends to cause torque / side loading on the pivots, and the Rohrbaugh attention to fit & finish.  8)

As for making a 9 mm pistol smaller than the R9 - I don't think I'd want to fire many rounds from one of those.
Lots of forum members have noted ergonomic issues with the R9.  Their hands are just too big to get the pistol to cycle properly.  I think it was Erich who found he had to trap his weak-side thumb between the grip and his strong-side thumb for reliable cycling.  
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